Please log in or register. Registered visitors get fewer ads.
Forum index | Previous Thread | Next thread
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places 07:49 - May 8 with 15205 viewsisitme

The English Football League will next week tell clubs in Leagues One and Two there is no chance of playing any more games this season and ask them to vote on a method to decide promotion and relegation.

EFL chairman Rick Parry told MPs on the Digital, Culture, Media and Sport select committee on Wednesday morning that a resolution to the season in the third and fourth tiers was only a matter of days away and it now seems a decision could come as early as Monday or Tuesday.

The Athletic understands the EFL board has already received several proposals from clubs, with the current favourite being a points-per-game (PPG) model weighted to reflect how many games the teams have played home and away.

The rationale for this idea is a non-weighted PPG calculation does not take into account the fact that some teams have four home games left, while others have six.

This season across the Football League, the home team has won 46 per cent of the time, with away teams winning only 26 per cent of the games. Over the last six EFL seasons, the average PPG at home is 1.55, compared to 1.19 away.

Under this method, which has been used to decide the tables in English grassroots club rugby union, each club’s PPG would be worked out for their home and away fixtures, then multiplied by 22 for League One, which had 23 clubs this season because of Bury’s demise last summer, and 23 for League Two and then added together to reach a total for the season.

The Athletic understands that a League One club has prepared a detailed explanation of this method, with a full set of final tables, and emailed it to the EFL board.

With the EFL admitting there is no chance of staging its traditional end-of-season play-offs in Leagues One and Two, the top three sides in the League One will be promoted to the Championship, with three going down to League Two, while four come up from League Two and only one goes down, to restore the EFL to its full quota of 72 teams.

The weighted PPG method does not change the top three in League One at all, meaning Coventry City would be crowned champions, with Rotherham United and Oxford United joining them in the Championship next season. The current bottom three — Tranmere Rovers, Southend United and Bolton Wanderers — would still be the bottom three, although Bolton would climb one spot, leaving Southend in last place.

In League Two, Swindon Town would leapfrog Crewe Alexandra into first place, with Plymouth Argyle staying in third but Cheltenham Town climbing over Exeter City to claim the final promotion spot. Stevenage Borough would remain in last place, despite the seven-point deduction Macclesfield Town received on Thursday for failing to fulfill a fixture or pay their players on time.

The Athletic has spoken to two other EFL clubs who said they were aware of this proposal and several others who said they were not, but every club approached said they knew of at least half a dozen different ideas that were circulating around the league. These include using the current tables to settle the finishing positions, a non-weighted PPG model and an idea to only count the first half of the season, which would be the first 22 games in League One and 23 games in League Two.

Some clubs have discussed using more complicated statistical models that factor in how hard each club’s run-in was before the season was suspended in March. There is considerable opposition to these models, though, with one club dismissing them as “hypothetical and unfair”.

The prospect of declaring the season “null and void” appears to have receded, as most clubs acknowledge this would be very unfair on the teams that have got themselves into the promotion place. It would also come with financial and legal risks.

However, any club faced with relegation is almost certainly going to object to being demoted on the basis of PPG, weighted or otherwise. This has led to some clubs suggesting either two or three clubs are promoted this season, with none relegated. Five teams would then be relegated from the divisions above next season, in order to reset them.

But this idea will face strong opposition from the English game’s bosses as it will lead to fixture congestion next season, complicate the distribution of central income and break the terms of the tripartite agreement the EFL, FA and Premier League signed when the top flight broke away from the EFL in 1992.

As things stand, however, both the Premier League and Championship are determined to finish this season’s fixtures in neutral stadiums behind closed doors, which would mean all these issues would be settled on the pitch in the top two divisions.
0

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 07:51 - May 8 with 3908 viewsisitme

Article taken from the Athletic. It is behind a paywall so I have posted the article, rather than link to the article.

Personally I agree with the proposals as if implemented the current top three will go up and the current bottom three will go down.
5
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 08:31 - May 8 with 3871 viewsBigDaveMyCock

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 07:51 - May 8 by isitme

Article taken from the Athletic. It is behind a paywall so I have posted the article, rather than link to the article.

Personally I agree with the proposals as if implemented the current top three will go up and the current bottom three will go down.


It seems as fair as any other method and any method will be unfair on someone. I wonder if they’ll calculate a margin of error (say 4 points) and if a team loses out on promotion or is relegated within the margin of error then it will receive extra cash as an acknowledgment. For example, if a League One team is relegated within the margin of error then it will still receive League One payments for the following season, or 2 if that already happens. It certainly won’t fully appease such teams but may make it more palatable.
[Post edited 8 May 8:33]

Poll: Was the Incredible Hulk a sh!thouse?

0

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 08:36 - May 8 with 3858 viewselectricblue

Finally we have a plausible plan to end the seasons....

Will there be any details on financial help for the lge 1&2 clubs forth coming......

My all time favourite Dale player Mr Lyndon Symmonds

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 09:39 - May 8 with 3763 views442Dale

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 08:31 - May 8 by BigDaveMyCock

It seems as fair as any other method and any method will be unfair on someone. I wonder if they’ll calculate a margin of error (say 4 points) and if a team loses out on promotion or is relegated within the margin of error then it will receive extra cash as an acknowledgment. For example, if a League One team is relegated within the margin of error then it will still receive League One payments for the following season, or 2 if that already happens. It certainly won’t fully appease such teams but may make it more palatable.
[Post edited 8 May 8:33]


Would argue that with radical changes already been acknowledged as required across the leagues that payments to L1 and L2 clubs should be the same for the next 2/3 seasons.

For example, why should we receive more money than Tranmere just because we’re lucky enough to be ahead of them as things stand?

Poll: Best Dale Game Ever: Last 16, Match 7

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 09:48 - May 8 with 3743 viewsTalkingSutty

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 08:36 - May 8 by electricblue

Finally we have a plausible plan to end the seasons....

Will there be any details on financial help for the lge 1&2 clubs forth coming......


The EFL stumped up £50 million last month to be distributed to Clubs as part of the end of season television and sponsorship money payment, in other words they got that payment early in order to help to alleviate immediate financial pressures. I’m not sure what the PFA are doing but they are sitting on a massive pile of money and have been criticised over the years for stockpiling money instead of using it to help their members. The Premiership Clubs could look after the lower league Clubs and not even blink an eye, donating maybe £1 million to each L1 and L2 Club would be a great gesture and probably stop some Clubs going to the wall.
3

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 10:56 - May 8 with 3578 viewsD_Alien

Reluctantly, i'm now in agreement with the proposal for a weighted points adjustment to produce final placings, with promotion/relegation occurring according to the agreed format, i.e. taking account of the additional L1 place required

This option would, i believe, allow the integrity of competition to be maintained to a greater extent than an attempt to complete fixtures involving potentially decimated squads. It might also set a precedent should (heaven forbid) such a recourse be required in the future, so at least we'd then have certainty rather than the myriad of options leading to disputes

At least it looks like the "declare season null and void" option is rapidly receding into the dustbin, where it belongs after such a significant proportion of fixtures had been completed
2

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:02 - May 8 with 3584 viewsncfc_chalky

I'm presuming that the National League will follow suit if this idea should go ahead with Barrow and Harrogate being promoted which I feel would be unfair as Notts was gaining momentum at the time and Barrow definitely showing signs of slowing down,I fancied our chances in the playoffs tbh and was hoping for a twice in a season Wembley visit
Barrow won't last in League Two and will come straight back down again with their lack of support and dump of a ground and I feel that we have been cheated out of a promotion
Having said all of that nobody could have forecasted what would happen this season and it's got to be sorted out one way or another and the only thing that will make it bearable is it Forest miss out on promotion
[Post edited 8 May 11:12]

Poll: Who will be glad to see Notts back in the football league?

0

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:06 - May 8 with 3568 viewspioneer

Wouldn’t argue against it given the other options but it’s hard on teams who had a poor start to the season but we’re finishing strong, like happened to us over the last two seasons. It would be interesting to look back to where we were points per game wise after the same number of games played in those two seasons.
0
Login to get fewer ads

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:13 - May 8 with 3521 viewsTVOS1907

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:02 - May 8 by ncfc_chalky

I'm presuming that the National League will follow suit if this idea should go ahead with Barrow and Harrogate being promoted which I feel would be unfair as Notts was gaining momentum at the time and Barrow definitely showing signs of slowing down,I fancied our chances in the playoffs tbh and was hoping for a twice in a season Wembley visit
Barrow won't last in League Two and will come straight back down again with their lack of support and dump of a ground and I feel that we have been cheated out of a promotion
Having said all of that nobody could have forecasted what would happen this season and it's got to be sorted out one way or another and the only thing that will make it bearable is it Forest miss out on promotion
[Post edited 8 May 11:12]


You've been cheated out of something that hasn't actually happened?

Good one.

EDIT: I take it using "cheated" is meant to be ironic.
[Post edited 8 May 11:20]

There's a difference between being a maestro and being able to use your brain

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:18 - May 8 with 3521 viewsAtThePeake

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:02 - May 8 by ncfc_chalky

I'm presuming that the National League will follow suit if this idea should go ahead with Barrow and Harrogate being promoted which I feel would be unfair as Notts was gaining momentum at the time and Barrow definitely showing signs of slowing down,I fancied our chances in the playoffs tbh and was hoping for a twice in a season Wembley visit
Barrow won't last in League Two and will come straight back down again with their lack of support and dump of a ground and I feel that we have been cheated out of a promotion
Having said all of that nobody could have forecasted what would happen this season and it's got to be sorted out one way or another and the only thing that will make it bearable is it Forest miss out on promotion
[Post edited 8 May 11:12]


Barrow had lost two league games since October, I'd hardly say that's slowing down.

"Everything I know about morality and the obligations of men, I owe it to football."

2
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:19 - May 8 with 3519 viewsjonahwhereru

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 07:51 - May 8 by isitme

Article taken from the Athletic. It is behind a paywall so I have posted the article, rather than link to the article.

Personally I agree with the proposals as if implemented the current top three will go up and the current bottom three will go down.


Thanks for this isitme.

I follow a National League rugby side who avoided relegation by the PPG system. They were overwhelmingly favourites to stay up mind. Which is the same situation the Dale would be in.

I think we have more home games left, and we haven’t been great at getting the points at home, so our board would do well the promote this option.
0

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:27 - May 8 with 3453 viewsShun

Thanks for sharing.

This definitely seems like the fairest way of doing things, and I really hope it happens.
0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:29 - May 8 with 3474 viewsncfc_chalky

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:18 - May 8 by AtThePeake

Barrow had lost two league games since October, I'd hardly say that's slowing down.


Harrogate would have caught them by the end of the season which would have left Barrow in the playoffs and beatable imo

Poll: Who will be glad to see Notts back in the football league?

0

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:31 - May 8 with 3468 viewsisitme

No problem sharing it.

The Athletic is a really good site with excellent NFL coverage as well as football. With it being a relevant article I thought I would copy and paste it. I don't think they will be on to me for a breach of copyright!
1

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:31 - May 8 with 3464 views442Dale

Obviously it’s a wind-up, but you have to admire the enduring nature of Notts County to be an irritation in all situations.

Poll: Best Dale Game Ever: Last 16, Match 7

3
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:35 - May 8 with 3446 viewsncfc_chalky

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:13 - May 8 by TVOS1907

You've been cheated out of something that hasn't actually happened?

Good one.

EDIT: I take it using "cheated" is meant to be ironic.
[Post edited 8 May 11:20]


Aye "cheated" was used tongue in cheek but I did think that we had a chance of going up,this is particularly gutting as there's a strong possibility that this was going to be my last season watching the Pies as I had plans to move away before the pandemic happened,promotion back to where we belong and a double visit to Wembley would have finished it off nicely

Poll: Who will be glad to see Notts back in the football league?

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:42 - May 8 with 3421 views442Dale

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:35 - May 8 by ncfc_chalky

Aye "cheated" was used tongue in cheek but I did think that we had a chance of going up,this is particularly gutting as there's a strong possibility that this was going to be my last season watching the Pies as I had plans to move away before the pandemic happened,promotion back to where we belong and a double visit to Wembley would have finished it off nicely


Lots of teams had a chance of going up. Lots of people will be feeling the same way for sure, it’s a tough one for so many.


Here’s the L1 table from twitter. Interesting to note that we’d have dropped to 22 points at home if we’d lost to Rotherham and narrowly avoided relegation.


Poll: Best Dale Game Ever: Last 16, Match 7

1
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:05 - May 8 with 3380 viewsBartRowou

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:42 - May 8 by 442Dale

Lots of teams had a chance of going up. Lots of people will be feeling the same way for sure, it’s a tough one for so many.


Here’s the L1 table from twitter. Interesting to note that we’d have dropped to 22 points at home if we’d lost to Rotherham and narrowly avoided relegation.



And we'd have lost that game if we'd had a wonder pitch.
SAVE MONEY & KEEP THE CABBAGE PATCH.

Poll: Should Bury shop elsewhere for frames?

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:07 - May 8 with 3347 viewsTVOS1907

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:29 - May 8 by ncfc_chalky

Harrogate would have caught them by the end of the season which would have left Barrow in the playoffs and beatable imo


How do you know Harrogate would have caught them? I think they still had to play each other. Barrow might have won that game.

There's a difference between being a maestro and being able to use your brain

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:22 - May 8 with 3310 viewsTVOS1907

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 11:42 - May 8 by 442Dale

Lots of teams had a chance of going up. Lots of people will be feeling the same way for sure, it’s a tough one for so many.


Here’s the L1 table from twitter. Interesting to note that we’d have dropped to 22 points at home if we’d lost to Rotherham and narrowly avoided relegation.



Sunderland & Ipswich had played the most games in League One (36), so how about using PPG to scale everyone up to a 36-game points total?

It's a more realistic representation of what has already happened in games played and means less future games to be factored in for what might happen.

As it is, they could be effectively predicting Dale's next ten results, whereas under my proposal, it would only be predicting our next two.

I know this has got more holes than a colander, but it's another possibility.

This is what it gives:

Coventry 70.94
Rotherham 63.77
Wycombe 62.47
Fleetwood 61.71
Oxford 61.71
Portsmouth 61.71
Peterborough 60.69
Sunderland 59.00
Doncaster 57.18
Gillingham 52.46
Ipswich 52.00
Burton 49.37
Blackpool 46.29
Bristol R 46.29
Shrewsbury 43.41
Lincoln 43.20
Accrington 41.14
Rochdale 38.12
MK Dons 38.06
AFC Wimbledon 36.00
Tranmere 33.88
Southend 19.54
Bolton 14.82


Or what about Duckworth-Lewis-Stern?
[Post edited 8 May 12:22]

There's a difference between being a maestro and being able to use your brain

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:32 - May 8 with 3305 viewsncfc_chalky

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:07 - May 8 by TVOS1907

How do you know Harrogate would have caught them? I think they still had to play each other. Barrow might have won that game.


Harrogate was on a far better run than Barrow before the games stopped and I think that Harrogate had home advantage,my money would have been on them

Poll: Who will be glad to see Notts back in the football league?

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:54 - May 8 with 3244 views442Dale

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:32 - May 8 by ncfc_chalky

Harrogate was on a far better run than Barrow before the games stopped and I think that Harrogate had home advantage,my money would have been on them


Over 37 matches Barrow were on a far better run than Harrogate before games stopped.

Poll: Best Dale Game Ever: Last 16, Match 7

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:55 - May 8 with 3247 viewsAtThePeake

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:32 - May 8 by ncfc_chalky

Harrogate was on a far better run than Barrow before the games stopped and I think that Harrogate had home advantage,my money would have been on them


Harrogate had picked up one point more than Barrow in their last six games. I think you're over-estimating Barrow's 'dip' in form because they lost to Notts in their last game before the lockdown.

"Everything I know about morality and the obligations of men, I owe it to football."

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:56 - May 8 with 3237 views442Dale

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:55 - May 8 by AtThePeake

Harrogate had picked up one point more than Barrow in their last six games. I think you're over-estimating Barrow's 'dip' in form because they lost to Notts in their last game before the lockdown.


That and the fact it isn’t the nicest ground to visit in early March.

Poll: Best Dale Game Ever: Last 16, Match 7

0
Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:58 - May 8 with 3208 viewsTVOS1907

Exclusive: Leagues One and Two abandoned, clubs to vote how to decide places on 12:32 - May 8 by ncfc_chalky

Harrogate was on a far better run than Barrow before the games stopped and I think that Harrogate had home advantage,my money would have been on them


Rotherham were on a far better run than us when they came to Spotland on 7th March.

We beat them 3-1.

There's a difference between being a maestro and being able to use your brain

0

Please log in or register. Registered visitors get fewer ads.
About Us Contact Us Terms & Conditions Privacy Cookies Advertising
© FansNetwork 2020