| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH 10:49 - Aug 25 with 21097 views | NotLoyal |
It’s the country and western town of Preston. The team with P N and E in their name. Let’s add an I and an S.
Saturday 28th August 2021
Deepdale Stadium
Kick Off 3pm
It’s the final game before the international break, that’s the last game before the next ones start, which will be at the end of the international break.
Match Officials
THOMAS BRAMALL
Thomas loves a card. 21 🟨 in his first 10 games. The EFL generally give him league one or two games so this is a step up.
Assisted by : Richard Wild and Steven Meredith
Fourth Official : Robert Lewis
Preston is famous for many things, the first KFC, the first Motorway, the word ‘teetotal’ comes from Preston, which I as your host totally agree with. It’s also a fact that the highest amount of bellends in the country come from Preston, oh, but think, yes bellends are made in Preston, the very ends of bells in church spires ( or lofts ) that make the noise that bloody annoy you on Sundays. That’s why they have a church with the tallest spire in England, to fit all the bellends in.
The home ends at Preston are also full of bellends.
https://www.fansnetwork.co.uk/football/swanseacity/news/55617/six-players-unavai
On the day tickets will be available to purchase from the away ticket office at Deepdale.
The away ticket office is located at the Bill Shankly Kop, adjacent to the away turnstiles.
Get your vaccination today
“We hope it provides an accessible and convenient chance for supporters of both the Lilywhites, and our visitors Swansea City, to be able to get a first or second dose of the vaccine while attending the game.” Dr Zak Patel, Clinical Director, the Preston North Primary Care Network (PCN) said: “We are incredibly proud to be able to offer a mobile Covid-19 vaccination clinic in a place that is convenient and accessible, for footballers and fans alike. “Whether you’re looking forward to getting back to spending time with family and friends, planning your next holiday or counting down the days until your favourite festival, the vaccine will help keep you and those around you safe.
Preston North End: Daniel Iversen, Sepp van den Berg, Ben Whiteman, Patrick Bauer, Daniel Johnson (captain), Jordan Storey, Andrew Hughes, Ryan Ledson, Emil Riis, Sean Maguire, Josh Earl.
Substitutes: Declan Rudd, Greg Cunningham, Josh Harrop, Joe Rafferty, Scott Sinclair, Joe Rodwell-Grant, Brad Pott.
Swansea City: Steven Benda; Joel Latibeaudiere, Ryan Bennett, Ryan Manning; Ethan Laird, Jay Fulton, Matt Grimes (captain), Jake Bidwell; Jamie Paterson; Liam Cullen, Joel Piroe.
Substitutes: Ben Hamer, Kyle Naughton, Brandon Cooper, Dan Williams, Yan Dhanda, Morgan Whittaker, Jamal Lowe.
https://www.fansnetwork.co.uk/football/swanseacity/news/55643/russell-martin-agr
Nothing to follow.
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY TEAMS AND THREAD on 01:53 - Aug 30 with 956 views | WalterBoyd |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY TEAMS AND THREAD on 00:58 - Aug 30 by Dr_Parnassus |
You mean against a lower league side in the cup?
We have won 1 game in the league in 5 attempts, and ironically that was the one where he seemed to accuse the players of deviating from the plan.
In those 5 games we have given up 67 (yes, sixty seven) shots to our opposition.
We also find ourselves bottom of the league in shots attempted too. [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 1:10]
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It's hard to argue with facts.
In the morning get ready for :
1. Covid
2.Lack of fitness ( throwing the players under the bus ,
3. Tired ( throwing the players under the bus)
4. Preseason ( no other team in the leage was affected by this)
5. New tactics, our players have never been asked to keep possession before and be entertaining, it's a whole new concept to them. They were taught to hoof and give the ball away as often ad you can, bless them.
6. All the tidy ones are being sold, if any poor sod will buy them
7. I have only been here for 1 week, 2 weeks, 3 week, 4 week 1 year, 5 years... no other job in the world accepts such bullshit excuses but Swans fans do.
Besides all that good, some fans happy to get relegated together back to the Swansea way.
To be fair, I am almost happy to get to league zero to avoid such bull shitting , pass the buck , its his fault not mine , dodge the bullet ness as this arse wipe spouts in every post match interview.
Do you friggin job that you get paid for.
Possession based entertaining football my arse, not yet it ain't.
Besides that Russ is doing a great job, let's give him time. |  | | |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY TEAMS AND THREAD on 07:14 - Aug 30 with 893 views | jackrmee |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY TEAMS AND THREAD on 22:06 - Aug 29 by Dr_Parnassus |
Again, it has nothing to do with time, my question was who has struggled to implement their style early in the last 20 years for us? The answer is nobody, and some of those style changes have been radical.
So the notion of needing all this time before showing any semblance of it being the correct way to play isn’t true.
They may have needed a bit of time to make it perfect/optimum but we have always seen acceptable results, simply because the style suited the players we had at our disposal on some sort of level.
Farke got £65m worth of youth talent, Pukki, Buendia and Krul before he was able to mount any sort of acceptable finish. I would guess it had more to do with them than “time”.
What do you mean you will never get to know if it’s up to “your lot”? I am not advocating sacking him, I’m making the point that what he is implementing needs to suit our players in order to work.
If it does suit them, then we should still see some form of short term successes before allowing him time to perfect/optimise that style. The proof of that is clear. [Post edited 29 Aug 2021 22:18]
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You act as if all humans are the same.
So you reckon that no-one else has needed time, so why should we give RM time is it? What the heck are you on about. What a beauty haha.
You are also saying that Farke had this and that.
The Norwich fans must be psychic then. They knew it was all coming and that's why they gave Farke time is it?
You pretend you're not advocating sacking him, as you don't want to look like a tit. But you are advocating sacking him.
If you could change the manager now, you would. |  |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 07:29 - Aug 30 with 891 views | jackrmee |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 00:47 - Aug 30 by Dr_Parnassus |
For completion. We will go Guehi too.
Last season we were without him for 6 games, we lost 1 of them. 3 wins, 2 draws and 1 loss.
1.63 points per game and if that form continued for the season would see us on 75 points.
………….
So even without Ayew and Guehi, this squad is capable of not only competing but winning and picking up play off targeting points tally’s.
That same squad is essentially the same one Martin has, but has had a million pound striker, Downes and Laird thrown into the mix.
There isn’t too many reasons that we are looking so hapless, when we know what can be achieved with this team. |
So you reckon we didnt need those 2 last season!!
We would have still got to the playoff final without them?
If you go by them stats, we are actually better off without those players.
You must be right. Russell Martin should be sacked, as he has a better side than Cooper did. SACK HIM NOW!
Idiot. | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY TEAMS AND THREAD on 07:40 - Aug 30 with 883 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY TEAMS AND THREAD on 07:14 - Aug 30 by jackrmee |
You act as if all humans are the same.
So you reckon that no-one else has needed time, so why should we give RM time is it? What the heck are you on about. What a beauty haha.
You are also saying that Farke had this and that.
The Norwich fans must be psychic then. They knew it was all coming and that's why they gave Farke time is it?
You pretend you're not advocating sacking him, as you don't want to look like a tit. But you are advocating sacking him.
If you could change the manager now, you would. |
Where have I said why should we give Martin time?
I said he can have time to make his system optimum and iron out any flaws, but we will need to be seeing an upward curve towards that goal. Meaning acceptable performances before hand.
Right now we aren’t.
What do you mean the Norwich fans gave him time? It’s not up to the Norwich fans, like I said earlier in the thread.. if we are to make this comparison to Farke, from here we will win 5 of our next 8 games losing none of them.
Reckon we will?
“ You pretend you're not advocating sacking him, as you don't want to look like a tit. But you are advocating sacking him.
If you could change the manager now, you would.”
You are desperate for that to be the case, I understand. Sadly the reality is very different. Are you the poster that said I wanted Martin dead… only to edit it later?
You don’t half talk some nonsense. |  |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 07:45 - Aug 30 with 883 views | jack247 |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 00:41 - Aug 30 by Dr_Parnassus |
Also I really have an issue with the Ayew and Guehi excuse.
Last year we were without Ayew for 5 games either completely or where he was able to play 20 mins or less.
We lost 1 of them.
The year previous we were without Ayew for 2 games.
We won one and drew the other.
Over the two seasons we have been without Ayew for 7 games. Won 3, drew 3 and lost 1. Which is 1.75 points per game and gives us 80 points if that form was over the whole season, which is exactly what we got last year. |
If we still had Ayew and Guehi, I doubt Steve Cooper would have bottled this season and none of the questions around Russell Martin would have arose. | | | |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 07:48 - Aug 30 with 879 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 07:29 - Aug 30 by jackrmee |
So you reckon we didnt need those 2 last season!!
We would have still got to the playoff final without them?
If you go by them stats, we are actually better off without those players.
You must be right. Russell Martin should be sacked, as he has a better side than Cooper did. SACK HIM NOW!
Idiot. |
I didn’t say we didn’t need them, I said we adapted without them and got results.
Where did I say sack Martin? You are being awfully silly.
Why are you desperate for people to slag off the manager? | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 07:51 - Aug 30 with 878 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 07:45 - Aug 30 by jack247 |
If we still had Ayew and Guehi, I doubt Steve Cooper would have bottled this season and none of the questions around Russell Martin would have arose. |
I doubt it. I don’t think anyone was expecting to keep either were they? So I don’t believe either came into the decision at all.
I think the issue came in January where he wasn’t able to bring in who he felt we needed (number 9) and apparently had a lot to do with Grimes being shifted on.
He was able to adapt and get results without both on a consistent basis as I showed in the stats above.
Seemed to be more a principle thing than a “bottle” thing. He was one of the longest serving managers in our recent history. If bottle was an issue then he wouldn’t have stayed for a second term knowing that Brewster, Gallagher, VdH, Rodon etc were all leaving.
So again based on what we know, it seems incredibly unlikely it was due to losing a loanee and someone who we knew was leaving all season and reports suggest it was a breakdown in relationship since January, which would also fit the timeline of events.
Seems strange to reach conclusions that don’t fit with that. [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 8:01]
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY TEAMS AND THREAD on 07:56 - Aug 30 with 875 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY TEAMS AND THREAD on 01:53 - Aug 30 by WalterBoyd |
It's hard to argue with facts.
In the morning get ready for :
1. Covid
2.Lack of fitness ( throwing the players under the bus ,
3. Tired ( throwing the players under the bus)
4. Preseason ( no other team in the leage was affected by this)
5. New tactics, our players have never been asked to keep possession before and be entertaining, it's a whole new concept to them. They were taught to hoof and give the ball away as often ad you can, bless them.
6. All the tidy ones are being sold, if any poor sod will buy them
7. I have only been here for 1 week, 2 weeks, 3 week, 4 week 1 year, 5 years... no other job in the world accepts such bullshit excuses but Swans fans do.
Besides all that good, some fans happy to get relegated together back to the Swansea way.
To be fair, I am almost happy to get to league zero to avoid such bull shitting , pass the buck , its his fault not mine , dodge the bullet ness as this arse wipe spouts in every post match interview.
Do you friggin job that you get paid for.
Possession based entertaining football my arse, not yet it ain't.
Besides that Russ is doing a great job, let's give him time. |
I really am not buying the lack of fitness/tired excuse. We are looking hapless from the first kick and have conceded in our defeats usually within the first 30 mins.
If we were starting off well and then tailing off late and conceding late goals then fitness may be a reason for that. But fitness being an issue as to why we aren’t playing well from the first whistle seems odd to me.
To be fair to him, it seems like it’s certain sections of the fan base making most of the excuses. Some of the myths being invented on the daily is something rather spectacular, it’s like the myths created when Cooper was here… but for the opposite reason. | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 08:18 - Aug 30 with 859 views | jack247 |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 07:51 - Aug 30 by Dr_Parnassus |
I doubt it. I don’t think anyone was expecting to keep either were they? So I don’t believe either came into the decision at all.
I think the issue came in January where he wasn’t able to bring in who he felt we needed (number 9) and apparently had a lot to do with Grimes being shifted on.
He was able to adapt and get results without both on a consistent basis as I showed in the stats above.
Seemed to be more a principle thing than a “bottle” thing. He was one of the longest serving managers in our recent history. If bottle was an issue then he wouldn’t have stayed for a second term knowing that Brewster, Gallagher, VdH, Rodon etc were all leaving.
So again based on what we know, it seems incredibly unlikely it was due to losing a loanee and someone who we knew was leaving all season and reports suggest it was a breakdown in relationship since January, which would also fit the timeline of events.
Seems strange to reach conclusions that don’t fit with that. [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 8:01]
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Five games spread over a season is not a consistent basis.
I agree he was upset in January and justifiably so. I’m pretty sure he was chasing a new contract after that though?
I didn’t suggest there was any realistic prospect of keeping either (in the Championship). I said I doubt he’d have walked if we had kept them. Surely he’d have backed himself to at least equal his previous two seasons playoff finishes?
Back to more immediate matters, we’re five games into what most people expected to be a transition season. Given how the summer went and how radical the change in style has been, people shouldn’t be surprised or concerned yet.
Martin has now got two weeks with most of the squad and will probably have two or three players he wants by tomorrow night. If we pick up four points from the next five games and are still conceding multiple chances by giving the ball away at the back, it will be time to start worrying. | | | |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 09:22 - Aug 30 with 809 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 08:18 - Aug 30 by jack247 |
Five games spread over a season is not a consistent basis.
I agree he was upset in January and justifiably so. I’m pretty sure he was chasing a new contract after that though?
I didn’t suggest there was any realistic prospect of keeping either (in the Championship). I said I doubt he’d have walked if we had kept them. Surely he’d have backed himself to at least equal his previous two seasons playoff finishes?
Back to more immediate matters, we’re five games into what most people expected to be a transition season. Given how the summer went and how radical the change in style has been, people shouldn’t be surprised or concerned yet.
Martin has now got two weeks with most of the squad and will probably have two or three players he wants by tomorrow night. If we pick up four points from the next five games and are still conceding multiple chances by giving the ball away at the back, it will be time to start worrying. |
Of course it is, consistent basis doesn’t mean it needs to be weekly, it means when it happens the result is consistent. I think you mean “regular”.
Above is a spread of 9/10 games without Ayew and/or Guehi and we have consistently adapted and got results in keeping with our overall league form.
Whether he wanted a better contract doesn’t really back either notion. He also knew Guehi and Ayew were going at that time too. As did we all…
I don’t think it was about “backing himself”, as I said. From what it sounds like it was a matter of principle as opposed to the challenge. Selling his captain seemed to be the final straw according to reports on what was an already strained relationship from January, so it doesn’t sound like either Ayew or Guehi comes into it, which would have been my take on it without the reports too.
Being 5 games in doesn’t really mean anything, yes we expected to have a mid table like finish but at no point did I think we would look completely hapless. I can only presume neither did you? I think the belligerence to play a certain way despite not having the personnel to, is indeed both suprising and concerning.
Unless you believe he will learn not to be after what, game 7? 9? 11? [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 9:24]
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 09:37 - Aug 30 with 792 views | jackrmee |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 09:22 - Aug 30 by Dr_Parnassus |
Of course it is, consistent basis doesn’t mean it needs to be weekly, it means when it happens the result is consistent. I think you mean “regular”.
Above is a spread of 9/10 games without Ayew and/or Guehi and we have consistently adapted and got results in keeping with our overall league form.
Whether he wanted a better contract doesn’t really back either notion. He also knew Guehi and Ayew were going at that time too. As did we all…
I don’t think it was about “backing himself”, as I said. From what it sounds like it was a matter of principle as opposed to the challenge. Selling his captain seemed to be the final straw according to reports on what was an already strained relationship from January, so it doesn’t sound like either Ayew or Guehi comes into it, which would have been my take on it without the reports too.
Being 5 games in doesn’t really mean anything, yes we expected to have a mid table like finish but at no point did I think we would look completely hapless. I can only presume neither did you? I think the belligerence to play a certain way despite not having the personnel to, is indeed both suprising and concerning.
Unless you believe he will learn not to be after what, game 7? 9? 11? [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 9:24]
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We have been "completely hapless" in one game.
Do you think our last manager got through all our games without having at least one performance which was in the same vane? | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 09:51 - Aug 30 with 783 views | jackrabbit |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 08:18 - Aug 30 by jack247 |
Five games spread over a season is not a consistent basis.
I agree he was upset in January and justifiably so. I’m pretty sure he was chasing a new contract after that though?
I didn’t suggest there was any realistic prospect of keeping either (in the Championship). I said I doubt he’d have walked if we had kept them. Surely he’d have backed himself to at least equal his previous two seasons playoff finishes?
Back to more immediate matters, we’re five games into what most people expected to be a transition season. Given how the summer went and how radical the change in style has been, people shouldn’t be surprised or concerned yet.
Martin has now got two weeks with most of the squad and will probably have two or three players he wants by tomorrow night. If we pick up four points from the next five games and are still conceding multiple chances by giving the ball away at the back, it will be time to start worrying. |
Well said. Oh no here we go again!
Seriously though, your last 2 paragraphs sum up what I was trying to say in my earlier post. I don’t know if Martin is going to be a hit or a miss, but I think it’s a bit early in his tenure to be making my mind up on that. What I do know, is that unlike Bradley he was a player at this level, so he knows the game as it is played at this level, and he has contacts at this level. Bob Bradley he ain’t.
He might be another Roberto, …..or not - we’ll see. It’ll be useful if he can pick up his own Angel Rangel, Ash Williams, Leon Britton and Nathan Dyer, not to mention putting Routs through a rejuvenation process. Whatever. - we need players. He’s made a start on that and I’ve liked what I’ve seen. [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 9:54]
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:16 - Aug 30 with 735 views | vetchonian |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 08:18 - Aug 30 by jack247 |
Five games spread over a season is not a consistent basis.
I agree he was upset in January and justifiably so. I’m pretty sure he was chasing a new contract after that though?
I didn’t suggest there was any realistic prospect of keeping either (in the Championship). I said I doubt he’d have walked if we had kept them. Surely he’d have backed himself to at least equal his previous two seasons playoff finishes?
Back to more immediate matters, we’re five games into what most people expected to be a transition season. Given how the summer went and how radical the change in style has been, people shouldn’t be surprised or concerned yet.
Martin has now got two weeks with most of the squad and will probably have two or three players he wants by tomorrow night. If we pick up four points from the next five games and are still conceding multiple chances by giving the ball away at the back, it will be time to start worrying. |
please explain this radical change in style the way people talk you would think that not once over the last two seasons did we play the ball out from the back...its bsh1t....under the previous manager we often played the ball across the defence...so much so we gave away a goal at Stoke....
this post is not meant as a defence of Cooper or an attack on Martin but as a thought provoker... ..this squad is not that much weaker than we finished last season with..whilst Ayew,Geuhi Woodman and Hourihane have gone...we added Piroe at £1m we added pace with Joseph only for him to be loaned out,we have Whittaker who has shown since his arrival he has a goal in him..yet he too iit is said is to be loaned out,Hourihane no knectated and we have Patterson Walsh and Downes there is a gap with Gejhi but Cooper (Brandon) could plug that he is no worse than Geuhi was when he arrived and Woodman again was Marmite and we know could not play as Martin would want.
what is happening that when we have been crying out for pace we loan our Garrick and Joseph.
it has been said there has been little time spent on the grass why ?
wouldn't it be better practising one touch passing drillsgetting the players skills honed rather than analysing games which we lost because apparently we haven't the skills.
Playing possession football i?
about keeping the ball why have we no shape allowing us to do so ..players left isolated with no short passing options l
that's how it worked for us before the likes of Rangel and Dyer linking,Leon always acauble for a pass and then finding an other....there were never more than 5 yards between players that's how toy keep the ball....compare that to what we have seen from these first 5 games.. but it's ok and as we in a revolution...but what is so radical | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:22 - Aug 30 with 728 views | jackrmee |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:16 - Aug 30 by vetchonian |
please explain this radical change in style the way people talk you would think that not once over the last two seasons did we play the ball out from the back...its bsh1t....under the previous manager we often played the ball across the defence...so much so we gave away a goal at Stoke....
this post is not meant as a defence of Cooper or an attack on Martin but as a thought provoker... ..this squad is not that much weaker than we finished last season with..whilst Ayew,Geuhi Woodman and Hourihane have gone...we added Piroe at £1m we added pace with Joseph only for him to be loaned out,we have Whittaker who has shown since his arrival he has a goal in him..yet he too iit is said is to be loaned out,Hourihane no knectated and we have Patterson Walsh and Downes there is a gap with Gejhi but Cooper (Brandon) could plug that he is no worse than Geuhi was when he arrived and Woodman again was Marmite and we know could not play as Martin would want.
what is happening that when we have been crying out for pace we loan our Garrick and Joseph.
it has been said there has been little time spent on the grass why ?
wouldn't it be better practising one touch passing drillsgetting the players skills honed rather than analysing games which we lost because apparently we haven't the skills.
Playing possession football i?
about keeping the ball why have we no shape allowing us to do so ..players left isolated with no short passing options l
that's how it worked for us before the likes of Rangel and Dyer linking,Leon always acauble for a pass and then finding an other....there were never more than 5 yards between players that's how toy keep the ball....compare that to what we have seen from these first 5 games.. but it's ok and as we in a revolution...but what is so radical |
I agree Joseph had a great game at WB the other day. I'd ;like to have kept him.
I can't see Garrick being effective defensively at all though. He would not get gametime.
Martin has said that the cause for only getting 1 day on the grass is because of the fixtures and COVID restrictions at Fairwood.
He said it's difficult to get all the players together.
He also said that most of the time has been spent in the video room and analysis suite. These were also closed last week.
I suggest that before they can practice the drills RM wants them to, they have to learn what they are being asked to specifically do by watching the screens and learning that way. | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:28 - Aug 30 with 724 views | jack247 |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 09:22 - Aug 30 by Dr_Parnassus |
Of course it is, consistent basis doesn’t mean it needs to be weekly, it means when it happens the result is consistent. I think you mean “regular”.
Above is a spread of 9/10 games without Ayew and/or Guehi and we have consistently adapted and got results in keeping with our overall league form.
Whether he wanted a better contract doesn’t really back either notion. He also knew Guehi and Ayew were going at that time too. As did we all…
I don’t think it was about “backing himself”, as I said. From what it sounds like it was a matter of principle as opposed to the challenge. Selling his captain seemed to be the final straw according to reports on what was an already strained relationship from January, so it doesn’t sound like either Ayew or Guehi comes into it, which would have been my take on it without the reports too.
Being 5 games in doesn’t really mean anything, yes we expected to have a mid table like finish but at no point did I think we would look completely hapless. I can only presume neither did you? I think the belligerence to play a certain way despite not having the personnel to, is indeed both suprising and concerning.
Unless you believe he will learn not to be after what, game 7? 9? 11? [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 9:24]
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It wasn’t regular either, but by consistent I mean you can’t get enough consistency in 5 games to estimate how we’d have done in 46 (or 7/92) with any degree of accuracy. The fact your calculation shows we’d have been an average of 5 points per season better off without Ayew evidences that.
We all also knew Grimes was out of contract this season and unlikely to sign a new one. Resigning over selling him in that situation wouldn’t be a matter of principle, as it would be the right think to do.
I’m conscious of going down the Steve Cooper route though, it’s been done to death and I’m more interested in discussing Russell Martin. I was essentially just disagreeing with your point on Ayew and Guehi by saying in the hypothetical situation they had stayed, I’m sure he would too. Why wouldn’t he? 3 consecutive playoff finishes and out of contract. He’d have been sitting pretty in May.
I’ll admit I didn’t expect the change in style to be as drastic. I’d much prefer the wingbacks drop deeper to provide options when we play it out from the back and the midfielders to be further forward. I completely expected patchy results and performances, though I did expect more than 4 points after 5 games.
I don’t expect him to change his playing style at all. I think he’ll bring a couple in tomorrow and suddenly we’ll have 4 or 5 first teamers handpicked by Martin, plus the existing players he thinks are suited to his style.
The alternative would have been to play football closer to what we were used to until this point, or even January, then attempt to get us to play his way. As it stands, we’ve almost certainly got less points than we would have doing that, but the players have a months training and 7 games playing the way they will be required to play going forward. As long as we don’t find ourselves in genuine relegation danger, I’m ok with that.
I don’t expect everything to click a week Saturday, but do expect improvement from then on in. | | | |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:32 - Aug 30 with 721 views | jack247 |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:16 - Aug 30 by vetchonian |
please explain this radical change in style the way people talk you would think that not once over the last two seasons did we play the ball out from the back...its bsh1t....under the previous manager we often played the ball across the defence...so much so we gave away a goal at Stoke....
this post is not meant as a defence of Cooper or an attack on Martin but as a thought provoker... ..this squad is not that much weaker than we finished last season with..whilst Ayew,Geuhi Woodman and Hourihane have gone...we added Piroe at £1m we added pace with Joseph only for him to be loaned out,we have Whittaker who has shown since his arrival he has a goal in him..yet he too iit is said is to be loaned out,Hourihane no knectated and we have Patterson Walsh and Downes there is a gap with Gejhi but Cooper (Brandon) could plug that he is no worse than Geuhi was when he arrived and Woodman again was Marmite and we know could not play as Martin would want.
what is happening that when we have been crying out for pace we loan our Garrick and Joseph.
it has been said there has been little time spent on the grass why ?
wouldn't it be better practising one touch passing drillsgetting the players skills honed rather than analysing games which we lost because apparently we haven't the skills.
Playing possession football i?
about keeping the ball why have we no shape allowing us to do so ..players left isolated with no short passing options l
that's how it worked for us before the likes of Rangel and Dyer linking,Leon always acauble for a pass and then finding an other....there were never more than 5 yards between players that's how toy keep the ball....compare that to what we have seen from these first 5 games.. but it's ok and as we in a revolution...but what is so radical |
Do you not think our playing style is radically different now compared to last season? | | | |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:52 - Aug 30 with 698 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 09:37 - Aug 30 by jackrmee |
We have been "completely hapless" in one game.
Do you think our last manager got through all our games without having at least one performance which was in the same vane? |
I disagree I think we were hapless in them all, Bristol City aside. But that was when the players decided to move away from instructions according to Martin. | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:54 - Aug 30 with 690 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 09:51 - Aug 30 by jackrabbit |
Well said. Oh no here we go again!
Seriously though, your last 2 paragraphs sum up what I was trying to say in my earlier post. I don’t know if Martin is going to be a hit or a miss, but I think it’s a bit early in his tenure to be making my mind up on that. What I do know, is that unlike Bradley he was a player at this level, so he knows the game as it is played at this level, and he has contacts at this level. Bob Bradley he ain’t.
He might be another Roberto, …..or not - we’ll see. It’ll be useful if he can pick up his own Angel Rangel, Ash Williams, Leon Britton and Nathan Dyer, not to mention putting Routs through a rejuvenation process. Whatever. - we need players. He’s made a start on that and I’ve liked what I’ve seen. [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 9:54]
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Who is making their mind up on whether he is a hit or a miss?
I have made no predictions for the future, I’m simply commenting on what we have seen. So far what we have seen has been awful.. and going back to time, he will get it if he is showing signs that the team can play the way he wants.
So far they aren’t. | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:56 - Aug 30 with 688 views | jackrmee |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:52 - Aug 30 by Dr_Parnassus |
I disagree I think we were hapless in them all, Bristol City aside. But that was when the players decided to move away from instructions according to Martin. |
You would... | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 11:06 - Aug 30 with 667 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:28 - Aug 30 by jack247 |
It wasn’t regular either, but by consistent I mean you can’t get enough consistency in 5 games to estimate how we’d have done in 46 (or 7/92) with any degree of accuracy. The fact your calculation shows we’d have been an average of 5 points per season better off without Ayew evidences that.
We all also knew Grimes was out of contract this season and unlikely to sign a new one. Resigning over selling him in that situation wouldn’t be a matter of principle, as it would be the right think to do.
I’m conscious of going down the Steve Cooper route though, it’s been done to death and I’m more interested in discussing Russell Martin. I was essentially just disagreeing with your point on Ayew and Guehi by saying in the hypothetical situation they had stayed, I’m sure he would too. Why wouldn’t he? 3 consecutive playoff finishes and out of contract. He’d have been sitting pretty in May.
I’ll admit I didn’t expect the change in style to be as drastic. I’d much prefer the wingbacks drop deeper to provide options when we play it out from the back and the midfielders to be further forward. I completely expected patchy results and performances, though I did expect more than 4 points after 5 games.
I don’t expect him to change his playing style at all. I think he’ll bring a couple in tomorrow and suddenly we’ll have 4 or 5 first teamers handpicked by Martin, plus the existing players he thinks are suited to his style.
The alternative would have been to play football closer to what we were used to until this point, or even January, then attempt to get us to play his way. As it stands, we’ve almost certainly got less points than we would have doing that, but the players have a months training and 7 games playing the way they will be required to play going forward. As long as we don’t find ourselves in genuine relegation danger, I’m ok with that.
I don’t expect everything to click a week Saturday, but do expect improvement from then on in. |
That’s my point, it wasn’t regular because we were fortunate to keep them fit. But when we were without them, we consistently got results. That’s just a fact.
I am not suggesting we would have got 80 points, is simply a visual tool to understand the sort of results we were pulling off without them. No doubt that would have tailed off if we were without them more, but when we were without them we adapted successfully, suggesting this team is also capable of picking up regular points.
It is the same side as the ones we had without Ayew and Guehi plus a load of others including a £1m striker.
We did not know Grimes was unlikely to sign another. The end of Grimes’ contact also coincided with the end of Coopers. Him leaving at the end of his contract was of no consequence to Cooper. He wanted his captain for this season and is looks like he was told that he would be sold, considering the debacle in January he clearly wasn’t happy with that situation and facing it again trying to replace his captain.
You say you are conscious about going down the route but still keep referring to him and framing things in the negative despite essentially having to walk it all back last time you did it. You know I won’t let that slide so it’s probably best you move on.
As for why he wouldn’t stay if Ayew and Guehi stayed, is the same answer it was the last time you brought it up about an hour ago. It sounded like a breakdown of relationship after January and then being faced with having his captain sold from under him, plus what seemed like a block put in place to bigger clubs wanting Cooper by demanding an unrealistic amount of compensation.
Guehi and Ayew were never going to be here next season, it’s a pointless discussion. They clearly werent the reason he left, weren’t the reason he came and no doubt won’t be demanding them at his next job. It’s a moot talking point.
Nobody has said they expect everything clicking and firing on all cylinders in week 1, in fact it’s categorically been stated time to perfect or optimise it is fine, but time to make things even remotely acceptable is not something I think anyone signed up to.
Again I ask, who in our last 20 years has changed the style and not put acceptable results together relatively quickly? Nobody, is the answer… they all have (Bradley aside). They all required time to perfect their tactics, sure. But that isn’t what is currently being demanded on this board, apparently we have to give him months and months on end until we can critique a performance or make common sense observations that the level of performance isn’t anywhere near good enough. | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 11:08 - Aug 30 with 663 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 10:56 - Aug 30 by jackrmee |
You would... |
Yes I would.
We are bottom of the league in terms of shots attempted and 3rd from bottom in shots conceded.
That isn’t due to one game. | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 11:14 - Aug 30 with 649 views | jackrmee |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 11:08 - Aug 30 by Dr_Parnassus |
Yes I would.
We are bottom of the league in terms of shots attempted and 3rd from bottom in shots conceded.
That isn’t due to one game. |
Sack him now goddammit | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 11:17 - Aug 30 with 639 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 11:14 - Aug 30 by jackrmee |
Sack him now goddammit |
That would be a silly decision wouldn’t it?
Or do you think we need to sack everyone we critique? Are you the poster that said I wanted half our team sold and Martin to die?
I can only assume you are trolling again if so. | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 11:26 - Aug 30 with 622 views | jackrmee |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 11:17 - Aug 30 by Dr_Parnassus |
That would be a silly decision wouldn’t it?
Or do you think we need to sack everyone we critique? Are you the poster that said I wanted half our team sold and Martin to die?
I can only assume you are trolling again if so. |
You quite obviously want Martin gone.
You were the one who said that we don't have players to play in his style, so we shouldn't play that way until we get new players. Then you said we shouldn't sell any of them, but rather keep them until Martin is gone.
Says it all to me.
Stop talking crap mate.
Cue a load of stats and complaints that you didn't actually say those things in those exact words and twist everything.
You are very boring. Got you sussed. As does most people on here.
Proper joke of a bloke. Clear off. | |
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| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 11:31 - Aug 30 with 617 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| PNE v Swansea City MATCHDAY AFTERMATH on 11:26 - Aug 30 by jackrmee |
You quite obviously want Martin gone.
You were the one who said that we don't have players to play in his style, so we shouldn't play that way until we get new players. Then you said we shouldn't sell any of them, but rather keep them until Martin is gone.
Says it all to me.
Stop talking crap mate.
Cue a load of stats and complaints that you didn't actually say those things in those exact words and twist everything.
You are very boring. Got you sussed. As does most people on here.
Proper joke of a bloke. Clear off. |
If I wanted Martin gone then I wouldn’t say “I don’t want him sacked”.
You have an incredibly weak point of view and are simply trying to put them up against facts. In order to combat that you are implying my views are something they aren’t and attacking those fantasy views.
I see through it.
Again, are you the poster that said I wanted half the squad sold and wanted Martin dead? You keep avoiding the question. I am surprised you are still allowed to post after that.
If you can’t stand facts then maybe sign up to the Disney forum, I’m sure you can talk about fairy tales and happy endings to your hearts content there.
This is a football forum, we discuss what has happened and what is happening, not what may happen in a distant land under preferable circumstances.
If you don’t like it… tough. | |
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