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Reply | The Red Wall!
at 19:12 27 Aug 2024
Thank you for your fair and balanced response FT. I didn’t know that the club viewed the Itchen North as a necessary evil but I wouldn’t have thought that was the primary motivation for the change. Regarding a separate standing area in the ground, I’m not sure where that could be?
Ultimately I’ve become bored and frustrated by the poor atmosphere in the ground and I don’t know else you could try to improve it. I agree that generating atmosphere is far from just singing and I just wish we had more passion in our crowd generally. I’m sure the crowd has become significantly more passive in the years since we moved to SMS, as someone said we have a theatre audience in most parts of the ground. I remember some raucous atmospheres generated in SMS in the early days, even in the Kingsland but now when I shout people will sometimes look at me in disdain. So many people buy the merch, tell everyone that they are super fans but become mute once they step inside. I felt an initiative to gather those who will actually open their mouths is worth a go. Perhaps it won’t work but I thought the ‘I told you it wouldn’t work’ narrative to be unnecessary after 1 poor match. I felt there was triumphalism in that. Let’s review it as the season goes on.
I am probably of a similar age to you and I do despair of the same old Pompey/sh@thole/library etc etc songs but I don’t know what can be done without an influential leadership group within the support that can change the culture. Like you say I’m sure some of the older folk found us a pain in the @rse in the 90s but it’s definitely plummeted to new depths. |
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Reply | The Red Wall!
at 09:27 27 Aug 2024
Fair points Nick but in the absence of any fan group taking leadership I think the club were right to take the lead. This has been a talking point for years with logistical reason trawled out for why it couldn’t be done. The club have then made an effort to do something positive and it’s derided by some because ‘we’ve never had a proper home end’ and therefore status quo must persist. Its a shame we have no fan group to initiate changes as in the pre St Mary’s days and I have no problem with what Palace fans did- some might say it’s cringy but they’ve since established a reputation for their vociferous support. I always got the sense you were against it Nick but let’s at least give it a chance. We’ve got it, it’s not going away and I reckon that if the players actually turn up the volume from it could be impressive. |
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Reply | The Red Wall!
at 09:01 27 Aug 2024
If it’s not about bantz then why did the Itchen North establish itself in the corner adjacent to the away fans and why did the Itchen North spend most of the time facing the away fans and surging across? The notion that the closure of the Itchen North was a motivation for the change makes it sounds more significant than it was although I’m sure it was a pain in the @rse for the club to deal with. I read this forum a lot and you talk a lot of sense but on this point I can’t agree. You talk disparagingly about our fans a lot and I sympathise although it does come across as rather superior. But you seem to focus on your own enjoyment of the match day rather than what would make a difference to the atmosphere. It has been awful for years, the players notice it and something needed to be done. The point you miss I think is that whilst the Itchen North and Northam might’ve seemed decent inside them, the overall impact for the team and within the ground in general was negligible and attacking the Chapel never gave us any advantage in terms of helping with building some momentum, influencing refs etc. Surely you want your crowd more involved in the game rather than cultural pockets as you put it that have zero impact to what goes on on the field? |
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Reply | The Red Wall!
at 21:17 26 Aug 2024
It was entirely predictable that all those were against the wall and condemned it from the moment the concept started would be writing it off after one game to make their point. From what I could see from the Kingsland, all sections were involved in singing at some point, if not at the same time. That should improve. The noise as we attacked that end for 20 minutes after half-time was a big improvement on anything the previous Northam setup produced which had little if any impact on the games/players/refs. Saturday’s game was dire and there was nothing to get the crowd going, you cannot condemn it after one poor game. The influence of the away fans was undoubtedly diminished and that is something the players wanted to see; this was also part of the rationale for the change. It seems to me that those who don’t want the wall are the type who above all go to the games to ‘banter’ /goad away fans.
From my position in the Kingsland over the years, I found the noise generated in the old away
the away end embarrassingly loud and influential and the combined efforts of the Itchen and Northam have always been drowned out. Those of you who lament the loss of the Itchen North should be aware that you could barely be heard on the opposite side. To say the previous setup worked would, I am certain, be disputed by the players. For once I commend the club for trying to do something to give us an end that might just make the difference on occasions in terms of affecting the decisions we get from officials, helping with momentum building when attacking that end, getting under the skin of opposition players etc. I find the negativity on this so bizarre- why on earth would people give up on it after one game? Whilst crowds don’t win games, players need the crowd with them and having 2 small sections either side of the away fans never helped with that. It appears to me that a large number who congregate next to the away fans are just as motivated by telling them that they live in a shithole as they are seeing Saints win. A question: would people be happier if the Chapel could have been the safe standing area with the away fans where they are now so they could continue the ‘banter?’ |
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Reply | Saints showing some balls?...
at 11:45 9 Jun 2014
That argument doesn't make sense when he has left to go to a club pursuing at least the top six-he wouldn't have done that if he was afraid to take the next step! Far more likely he left us because the limit of the club's ambition was top 8 not his. |
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Reply | Utd suffering after Fergie departure
at 12:44 11 Jun 2013
Well we're going to find out if you're right over the next few years, I'd imagine Utd were paying out considerably more money than most other teams in First Division when they were relegated in '74 or were a mid table side in the 80s though. |
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Reply | Billy Sharp
at 09:35 27 May 2013
He's a good mate of Beattie's who's got the manager's job there, that must be why this is happening. Not exactly a great career move though... |
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Reply | Rodriguez
at 22:18 6 Apr 2013
Why would we do that when he is playing so well in his current postion? The flexibility of our system means he gets to run into the space created by Lambert who pulls players around with his movement and drops into midfield areas and allows Rodriguez and others to run ahead of him. The understanding between the two of them is growing all the time as well. As an out and out target man he would want to stay high up the pitch and he therefore wouldn't do the job Ricky does for him and others because his qualities are about being direct and scaring defenders with his pace. Today he played centrally at times anyway and our system can vary between 4-2-3-1 and 4-4-1-1 with Ricky dropping into the hole and Jay Rod ahead of him with Davis shifitng to the left. The fluidity of our play is superb at times and Lambert's movement is central to it so as I say I don't see why we would do it. |
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Reply | What player has been your biggest disappointment this season ?
at 11:38 22 Feb 2013
A bit harsh, not ready now but potential to be a very good keeper. Club got it wrong going with KD as no1 and he was then thrown in at the deep end behind a defence that was not exactly solid at the time. Going from lg 2 to struggling PL side was hardly ideal for him and his development. |
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Reply | What player has been your biggest disappointment this season ?
at 10:45 22 Feb 2013
Both Hooiveld and Fonte have performed better playing alongside Yoshida and in fairness Hooiveld has actually done a half decent job recently which has been a pleasant surprise. Davis was never going to be up to the PL so I won't count him as a disappointment as it is no surprise.
For me:
Ramires
Mayuka (given the money paid and lack of appearances)
Fox (though like Davis not really a surprise) |
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Reply | dream on fat sam
at 17:42 15 Feb 2013
Nick, I don't think anyone disputes what you are saying about Cortese's plan, we are debating whether WE think that is right, isn't that the whole point of discussion? In any case, forgetting sentiment, I think it would be the wrong footballing decision to sell him for £4m to West Ham, no doubt you'll say this can't be considered in this world of 'soccernomics'. It would also be a bit sad if as supporters we took any sentiment out of everything anyway and we don't actually know Cortese would accept an offer if the manager wants him to stay and, from what he's been quoted as saying about Lambert, it appears that he does. Rodriguez will be a top player imo but he is nowhere near being a replacement for Rickie unless his game changes dramatically over the next 6 months which I can't see. I actually question your judgement in that you have suggested he could replace him which is why I made a comment last week about under rating Rickie's imprtance to us. I genuinely think the team will have to adapt/evolve when he goes and his absence could be a lot more costly to us than a mere £4m if it's done rashly, it would be better phasing him out when the time comes. The Man Utd model for Giggs and Scholes is preferable to Chelsea's treatment of Lampard etc, and look at how they miss Drogba who could be compared to Rickie in terms of importance to their sides- that's my opinion though and will be dismissed as sentimental I expect! |
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Reply | dream on fat sam
at 12:02 15 Feb 2013
I accept you have to be objective but until we have someone who can replace him or change the way we play, it would be folly. He is our most important player, a talisman whose presence on the pitch clearly influences his team mates and the current manager seems to rate him too. Take him out of our side and the rest of the side would be lost. Obviously he will need replacing at some point but the side will have to change the way it is set up and evolve to play without out him. To just remove him for economic reasons and expect the side to adapt straight away would be daft. I rate J Rod and he is the future but I just don't see him as the replacement, totally different player with different attributes who may be part of a side without Rickie in the future. It would not be good 'soccernomics' to sell him for his market value and then struggle on the pitch because the side is not ready to play without him. |
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Reply | dream on fat sam
at 11:37 15 Feb 2013
Manchester United don't adopt this policy with players that are long serving and still able to make important contributions although past their best It works for them, do you really prefer the Chelsea approach to the likes of Lampard? |
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Reply | Defenders on posts at corners
at 15:14 8 Feb 2013
If Shaw hadn't been on the post Maloney would have been offside for Wigan's equaliser, if we'd had man on the post for their first it wouldn't have gone in so there is an argument. I'd still put me on the post but it's as black and white as that. |
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Reply | Hope for Lambert and England???
at 15:08 8 Feb 2013
Agree it probably won't and shouldn't happen but I think the point is that but for lack of pace he'd have been be an international, a discussion worth having-especially when you consider more mobile players who have gained caps but with less technical ability-Caroll a prime example. |
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Reply | Hope for Lambert and England???
at 14:57 8 Feb 2013
Yes I probably am taking those points in isolation and good response. Reading your reports over the years, I've just tended to feel that but maybe wrongly so. You sometimes comment that when others are criticsed, Rickie is one of the untouchables who is beyond criticism but his contribution and imoprtance to the side is so great that he has earned that. Barnard yes I take your points but I always felt it was clear he possessed none of the class and intelligence of Lambert, always a 100% player with more limited ability a lower halklf championship player at best- actaully the type the crowd as a whole normally love and you don't (blond runs around a lot!) I well remember being at Doncaster when Guly was being slated and the crowd wanting Barnard on and being bemused at the way some people wanted a player on just because he runs round around at 100mph and shows 'passion' |
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Reply | Hope for Lambert and England???
at 14:04 8 Feb 2013
I would agree up to a point except I would say his lack of mobility is perhaps the only thing that prevents him being an international footballer. Most of his game (control, football intelligence, movement off the ball, stiking of a ball) are as good as most but the only thing he lacks is mobility, but for that I am convinced he'd be an international player.
I wasn't surprised you said this Nick as I think you've under estimated how important he is to Saints over the years, eg Barnard was a better goal scorer/ we should sell him in the Summer and get what we can as he's getting on (31 for a striker who has only ever had limited mobility is not old imo) being two things I remember you saying. Championing Jay Rod as his future replacement I also disagree with as his game is all about mobility and pace, totally different player who lacks the qualties Lambert brings to us and you'd stuggle to play off/'around him in the way we do Rickie |
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