| Warburton - hope he stays for years 21:25 - Dec 3 with 9449 views | Greenbay |
Of course we should vent our feelings about the manager and the team - especially when we play some great football and then throw it all away.
After all we have to get rid of our frustrations somewhere!
This is a great place to do it and exchange ideas.
But to dismiss Warburton (as some have suggested especially when we lose) at the end of the season is nuts - totally nuts.
Even if we were relegated (and it won't happen) I would keep him - absolutely.
The question is - will Warburton want to stay?
He doesn't need the money. He does it cos his heart is in it.
And most of his philosophy is great.
He hasn't got the cash to spend unlike many Premier League clubs and some in the Championship.
How many of those Premier managers would survive in the Championship. Very few.
Warburton has the task of trying to spin gold from straw.
Remember when he came on board - following the disasters of previous years?
We have had huge financial problems, trying to improve a training ground, and a falling down stadium.
He was given a massive long-term task which he accepted.
1. That is - as we all know only too well - buy or hire low and sell high.
2. At the same time develop a team that is competitive at this level.
Yes let us all dream about a top 6 finish. That's what we all want but let's be realistic.
Warburton has done a fantastic job.
In just over 18 months he's had to dismantle a team - cos the wages were too high, create another last year which included loans - and we did well - and this year another new team - mainly youngsters - and we actually own them.
And in 45 minute bursts (especially the last 3 games) we have produced some of the best football that QPR has delivered in decades.
At the same time the owners have finally bought (to be developed) a big training ground.
This is not a 2/3 year project - it's a project for 5-10 years.
If we have success earlier than that - then great.
Of course we suffer especially when we play well as we did against Brentford and then Bristol City - and then lose.
But this is professional sport - fine margins.
Improvement comes by small margins.
Look at the British cycling team - a laughing stock not so long ago.
But by small margins they improved and are now one of the best in the world.
Is Warburton the man to lead us?
I believe he is. It's a long-term mission.
As long as the dressing room backs him - and we see small marginal gains then I hope he stays with us for a very long time.
This year the gains have been good.
Goalkeeper, right-back and left-back - all new (Dieng, Kakay, Hamaleinen) and progressing. Add Dickie.
We're not there yet - but we are on the right track.
Chair, Willock, BOS (until he goes) along with Carroll.
And I'm looking forward to seeing Bettache.
Then Dykes - he'll get there but give him time.
Bonne I hope and young Kelman.
We've got a lot to look forward too. And yes it's going to be a very bumpy ride, very frustrating but what we all saw in the last 3 games and in spells earlier this season was exciting and riveting.
Let's back Warburton and the team which hopefully is going to develop into a terrific side with one or two additions.
I rest my case. |  | | |  |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 08:09 - Dec 9 with 1331 views | nix |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 07:35 - Dec 9 by Gloucs_R |
Is our squad only good enough for 18th place?
Chair, BOS, Dickie, Dieng, Uncle... All Championship standard
Dykes, Bonne, Carroll, Willock, Cameron, Barbet, Ball... Would likely get another lower half championship club. (Although Cameron is probably in his last season)
Jury out on Thomas, Masterson, Kelman, Bettache, Willock as they've not played enough games
Niko, Kane, Kakay, Wallace, Kelly all League 1 standard.
When you look at that, you need to question who is responsible for signings. Edit... By question I mean, is it all about a resale value, about being competitive today, what do they look for... And who is now responsible? [Post edited 9 Dec 2020 8:34]
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What you are leaving out is Manning, Wzsolok, Freeman, Smithies, Bidwell, Robinson, McCarthy, Luongo, Wells, Hughill and Eze. I know two of those were on loan but we scouted them, made them look good in our team and then lost them because we can't afford them.
Plus the fact that we're doing it on a shoestring. When we were buying Caulker, SWP, Bosingwa, Maiga, Krancjar, Fer, Cesar, Sandro etc for ridiculous money, that's when we were doing badly.
We are trying to get a viable squad together to stay in the Championship and then build over time. We've got a quarter of the wages budget that we had a few years ago. If we had Forest or Derby's spending budget and were buying dross you'd have a point. Not everyone is working out but you could say the same of Manchester United, Manchester City, Chelsea etc.
I don't see how you can judge Willock, Dykes, Bonne, Kakay and Hamalainen on a handful of Championship games. Willock in particular looks like class to me but is inexperienced (although you've put him in two categories so even you're unsure about him).
Having tried to put the boot in the manager last week and got paltry support are you now going after Les and the scouting guys? I know there are teams with lower budgets above us but I bet they've all played together longer and played in the Championship for at least a season.
I think we're finally getting a squad together that we won't have to churn over half of at the end of the season. We all know what we need to give this squad a bit more bite but don't forget we are often in for players and then someone with more money swoops in and takes them off us. |  | | |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 08:28 - Dec 9 with 1275 views | Gloucs_R |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 08:09 - Dec 9 by nix |
What you are leaving out is Manning, Wzsolok, Freeman, Smithies, Bidwell, Robinson, McCarthy, Luongo, Wells, Hughill and Eze. I know two of those were on loan but we scouted them, made them look good in our team and then lost them because we can't afford them.
Plus the fact that we're doing it on a shoestring. When we were buying Caulker, SWP, Bosingwa, Maiga, Krancjar, Fer, Cesar, Sandro etc for ridiculous money, that's when we were doing badly.
We are trying to get a viable squad together to stay in the Championship and then build over time. We've got a quarter of the wages budget that we had a few years ago. If we had Forest or Derby's spending budget and were buying dross you'd have a point. Not everyone is working out but you could say the same of Manchester United, Manchester City, Chelsea etc.
I don't see how you can judge Willock, Dykes, Bonne, Kakay and Hamalainen on a handful of Championship games. Willock in particular looks like class to me but is inexperienced (although you've put him in two categories so even you're unsure about him).
Having tried to put the boot in the manager last week and got paltry support are you now going after Les and the scouting guys? I know there are teams with lower budgets above us but I bet they've all played together longer and played in the Championship for at least a season.
I think we're finally getting a squad together that we won't have to churn over half of at the end of the season. We all know what we need to give this squad a bit more bite but don't forget we are often in for players and then someone with more money swoops in and takes them off us. |
Easy Tiger. I didn't put the boot into the manager, I questioned him.
My comments on Willock, Dykes, Bonne were based on where they are at today and not a criticism. I think two of those will come good.
You'll NEVER find me having a dig at Les.
My point about recruitment.... Are we in a worst place now Penrice has gone and who makes the decisions?
My overall point is, do we have a squad better than 18th? Looking at it in black and white, I think we're probably underperforming slightly. But maybe not as much as I first thought.
Edit. The last paragraph in the earlier post was poorly worded in fairness so I've amended it. [Post edited 9 Dec 2020 8:38]
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| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 08:36 - Dec 9 with 1261 views | nix |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 08:28 - Dec 9 by Gloucs_R |
Easy Tiger. I didn't put the boot into the manager, I questioned him.
My comments on Willock, Dykes, Bonne were based on where they are at today and not a criticism. I think two of those will come good.
You'll NEVER find me having a dig at Les.
My point about recruitment.... Are we in a worst place now Penrice has gone and who makes the decisions?
My overall point is, do we have a squad better than 18th? Looking at it in black and white, I think we're probably underperforming slightly. But maybe not as much as I first thought.
Edit. The last paragraph in the earlier post was poorly worded in fairness so I've amended it. [Post edited 9 Dec 2020 8:38]
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Fair enough, I get a bit punchy sometimes. Although you did set up a poll as to whether we should get rid of him but yes I'll stand down, sorry.
I agree that it's weird about Penrice. But I think we have to be a bit realistic about what we can afford. We're buying bargain basement because we can only afford that and hoping we can develop them. I'd just like to have a bit of stability for a season and see what happens then. Look at how much BOS and Chair improved after a season of playing regularly. I'd like us not to write anyone off yet until they've played a decent number of minutes. | | | |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 08:45 - Dec 9 with 1239 views | Gloucs_R |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 08:36 - Dec 9 by nix |
Fair enough, I get a bit punchy sometimes. Although you did set up a poll as to whether we should get rid of him but yes I'll stand down, sorry.
I agree that it's weird about Penrice. But I think we have to be a bit realistic about what we can afford. We're buying bargain basement because we can only afford that and hoping we can develop them. I'd just like to have a bit of stability for a season and see what happens then. Look at how much BOS and Chair improved after a season of playing regularly. I'd like us not to write anyone off yet until they've played a decent number of minutes. |
I did the poll as I was genuinely interested to see where everyone's headspace was on this board in comparison to those on Twitter... As always with this board there are some very good arguments to both sides. What I have taken out of the debate is that we probably are underperforming slightly but with the squad and the set-up we have at this moment in time we are never going to be challenging the top 6. Mid table would be a result, as much as that pains me.
So where as I appreciate that some of my posts can be controversial, I do genuinely appreciate the responses and on many occasions have found my view and understanding swayed. [Post edited 9 Dec 2020 8:46]
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| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 08:50 - Dec 9 with 1220 views | nix |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 08:45 - Dec 9 by Gloucs_R |
I did the poll as I was genuinely interested to see where everyone's headspace was on this board in comparison to those on Twitter... As always with this board there are some very good arguments to both sides. What I have taken out of the debate is that we probably are underperforming slightly but with the squad and the set-up we have at this moment in time we are never going to be challenging the top 6. Mid table would be a result, as much as that pains me.
So where as I appreciate that some of my posts can be controversial, I do genuinely appreciate the responses and on many occasions have found my view and understanding swayed. [Post edited 9 Dec 2020 8:46]
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Looks like we're almost on the same page. | | | |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 09:52 - Dec 9 with 1157 views | TheChef |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 08:28 - Dec 9 by Gloucs_R |
Easy Tiger. I didn't put the boot into the manager, I questioned him.
My comments on Willock, Dykes, Bonne were based on where they are at today and not a criticism. I think two of those will come good.
You'll NEVER find me having a dig at Les.
My point about recruitment.... Are we in a worst place now Penrice has gone and who makes the decisions?
My overall point is, do we have a squad better than 18th? Looking at it in black and white, I think we're probably underperforming slightly. But maybe not as much as I first thought.
Edit. The last paragraph in the earlier post was poorly worded in fairness so I've amended it. [Post edited 9 Dec 2020 8:38]
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Clearly we've recruited better in some areas than others, and it's not going to be easy on the budget we have.
Positives are in the attacking areas and the fact we have two strikers we own rather than loaned from another club (and hopefully they will improve, given they are both new/fairly inexperienced in the Championship).
Defence and defensive midfield are clearly the areas we need to improve in, but even there with Dieng, Dickie and Carroll we have new proven performers this season, we just need to add more quality around them.
It takes time and as we know it's quite painful, Rome wasn't built in a day. But gradually, we're getting there. |  |
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| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 10:34 - Dec 9 with 1114 views | PinnerPaul |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 22:26 - Dec 8 by 2Thomas2Bowles |
So, those subs, they went well... |
Sacking offence though?  | | | |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 11:22 - Dec 9 with 1062 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 10:34 - Dec 9 by PinnerPaul |
Sacking offence though? |
Multiple offences, a list as long as a python M'Lord |  |
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| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 11:42 - Dec 9 with 1047 views | francisbowles |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 22:26 - Dec 8 by 2Thomas2Bowles |
So, those subs, they went well... |
We didn't lose the game though!
We can't have it both ways. We can't complain that players like Thomas are always injured, unfit and lack experience but then moan when they get a few minutes!
I think apart from that the subs were about a rest for Chair and Carroll, before we injure them or wear them out completely. Chair had switched off for the free kick that led to the goal. It was also about energy and concentration, fresh legs, harass Millwall and a little bit of extra height and physicality.
To have introduced Masterson into a back three, as others suggested on another thread, would have risked unsettling the defence and probably resulted in a back five which would have invited more pressure from the opponents. There weren't too many other options. | | | |
| Warburton - hope he stays for years on 17:28 - Dec 19 with 910 views | eastside_r |
All is for the best in the best of all possible worlds. |  | | |
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