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Energy bills 23:01 - Aug 24 with 46045 viewsHayesender

Watching the news earlier, they were talking about the impact these energy bill rises will have on small businesses.

It got me thinking (dangerous I know) about the potential effect it could have on our club, and other clubs of similar and smaller size?

Not only the day to day running costs and matchday costs, but also the affect its gonna have on attendances.

Obviously when it comes down to heating, eating, mortgage, rent etc, days out with mates and family watching football, or any sporting event, are gonna have to take a back seat for many people.

Unless the government (lol) take action now, its gonna be a bleak winter for many people and businesses, and I fear for people's mental well being

Poll: Shamima Beghum

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Energy bills on 08:18 - Aug 30 with 3340 viewsSakura

Energy bills on 08:04 - Aug 30 by BazzaInTheLoft

Just so everyone (especially the White Westerners mentioned) knows which way this thread is heading ahead of time, Real Vision, the creator of this video, is a Crypto currency marketing company.

https://www.realvision.com/crypto
[Post edited 30 Aug 2022 8:08]


Just so everyone knows the definition of a straw man argument

"A straw man is a form of argument having the impression of refuting an argument, whereas the real subject of the argument was not addressed or refuted, but instead replaced with a false one"

The creator of this post is not able to comment on the content that threatens his world view and so provides a textbook example of a Strawman argument


(Note- James I do agree we have no choice now because of these past mistakes to help the very poorest in society- not those that own assets like their homes - but in rented or council housing only- I just don’t think giving tens of billions to the shareholders of our public utilities is a good use of our dwindling real resources in the context of videos like this)
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Energy bills on 09:17 - Aug 30 with 3236 viewsslmrstid

Sounds to me like Russian Bot is back. Yay...
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Energy bills on 10:37 - Aug 30 with 3121 viewsGloryHunter

on 01:00 - Jan 1 by



That's very interesting. Well spotted, and posted.
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Energy bills on 10:44 - Aug 30 with 3106 viewsJigsore

on 01:00 - Jan 1 by



this country hates building any kind of infrastructure, only dismantling it for the shortest of short term profit for political allies

the green lobby lol

“The thing about football - the important thing about football - is that it is not just about football.”

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Energy bills on 10:46 - Aug 30 with 3099 viewsBazzaInTheLoft

on 01:00 - Jan 1 by



Seems like this is an endorsement of the Green lobby Clive. One of their calls is a end to reliance on foreign and energy in exchange for wind.

Even the big guy said so.

‘The Saudi Arabia of Wind’

[Post edited 30 Aug 2022 10:49]
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Energy bills on 10:50 - Aug 30 with 3083 viewsozexile

Allegedly a minor bank here is going to refuse finance in 2025 for any car that isn't electric. So my question moving forward is what is going to power the electricity in the future for all these electric cars? Solar? Wind?
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Energy bills on 10:52 - Aug 30 with 3077 viewsBazzaInTheLoft

Energy bills on 10:50 - Aug 30 by ozexile

Allegedly a minor bank here is going to refuse finance in 2025 for any car that isn't electric. So my question moving forward is what is going to power the electricity in the future for all these electric cars? Solar? Wind?


Yes

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Energy bills on 12:03 - Aug 30 with 2974 viewsQPR_John

Energy bills on 10:52 - Aug 30 by BazzaInTheLoft

Yes



Sounds great but where does the government get back the money lost from fuel duty.
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Energy bills on 12:42 - Aug 30 with 2897 viewsBazzaInTheLoft

Energy bills on 12:03 - Aug 30 by QPR_John

Sounds great but where does the government get back the money lost from fuel duty.


- Windfall / Corperation tax
- Lower NHS costs

For starters
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Energy bills on 13:19 - Aug 30 with 2827 viewselnombre

Energy bills on 08:18 - Aug 30 by Sakura

Just so everyone knows the definition of a straw man argument

"A straw man is a form of argument having the impression of refuting an argument, whereas the real subject of the argument was not addressed or refuted, but instead replaced with a false one"

The creator of this post is not able to comment on the content that threatens his world view and so provides a textbook example of a Strawman argument


(Note- James I do agree we have no choice now because of these past mistakes to help the very poorest in society- not those that own assets like their homes - but in rented or council housing only- I just don’t think giving tens of billions to the shareholders of our public utilities is a good use of our dwindling real resources in the context of videos like this)


Just so everyone knows the definition of 'confirmation bias', can you tell me how the GBP-USD exchange rate has moved over say, the last 5 years? Clue: barely at all.

Perhaps the only very recent decline in European currencies since mid Feb is less to do with dollar milkshake theory and more to do with a huge bloody European war starting about then?
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Energy bills on 13:28 - Aug 30 with 2797 viewsQPR_John

Energy bills on 12:42 - Aug 30 by BazzaInTheLoft

- Windfall / Corperation tax
- Lower NHS costs

For starters


I have no knowledge of how much the government gets from fuel duty but I would guess it is of a magnitude to be not covered by windfall taxes and/or Corporation tax especially as by definition a windfall tax is just that not a regular income stream.
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Energy bills on 13:29 - Aug 30 with 2796 viewskensalriser

Energy bills on 09:17 - Aug 30 by slmrstid

Sounds to me like Russian Bot is back. Yay...


Funny, I was just thinking that.

Poll: QPR to finish 7th or Brentford to drop out of the top 6?

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Energy bills on 13:32 - Aug 30 with 2788 viewskensalriser

Energy bills on 13:28 - Aug 30 by QPR_John

I have no knowledge of how much the government gets from fuel duty but I would guess it is of a magnitude to be not covered by windfall taxes and/or Corporation tax especially as by definition a windfall tax is just that not a regular income stream.


Don't worry, they'll think of something.

Poll: QPR to finish 7th or Brentford to drop out of the top 6?

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Energy bills on 13:43 - Aug 30 with 2760 viewsQPR_Jim

on 01:00 - Jan 1 by



The ICE is urging the government to "develop a sustainable solution that incorporates a mix of all types of generation, including renewable sources like wind and wave power, nuclear and cleaner coal and gas-fired power stations".

David Anderson, chair of ICE's energy board, warned that the alternative was a "return to the blackouts that marked the 'Winter of Discontent' and brought the country grinding to a halt".

In other words they (ICE) were attempting to drum up work for their membership.

Thinking back to that ear, the lib-dems had some quite good policies about investment in renewables back in their 2010 manifesto which might have saved us all money in the long term.
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Energy bills on 14:11 - Aug 30 with 2707 viewsSakura

Energy bills on 13:19 - Aug 30 by elnombre

Just so everyone knows the definition of 'confirmation bias', can you tell me how the GBP-USD exchange rate has moved over say, the last 5 years? Clue: barely at all.

Perhaps the only very recent decline in European currencies since mid Feb is less to do with dollar milkshake theory and more to do with a huge bloody European war starting about then?


Isn’t the issue over the bill war not a fear that there will be a physical war with UK or Euro countries with the Russians but that they now can’t rely on importing Russian gas as they once did.

If it's just war related in isolation then why isn't that point consistent with the Russian ruble which in contrast has massively strengthened in that time compared to pre invasion?

Isnt it true that it's the energy importing nations who's currency have weakened. Like Europe , Uk and Japan which is consistent with that.

While our interest rates lag the US then this currency weakening only gets worse.

Got to say Baz video was good. Not focusing on the irony in that solar charging video that those wafers were likely made in China fuelled by coal power stations with no environmental controls.

The video is taken in Southern California. Wondering on what the difference might be for someone living somewhere slightly less sunny in the North of England. Do we think it might be a long drive back from away games over Christmas in future if relying on one of those charging stations to get you back
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Energy bills on 14:16 - Aug 30 with 2684 viewsR_from_afar

Energy bills on 08:04 - Aug 30 by BazzaInTheLoft

Just so everyone (especially the White Westerners mentioned) knows which way this thread is heading ahead of time, Real Vision, the creator of this video, is a Crypto currency marketing company.

https://www.realvision.com/crypto
[Post edited 30 Aug 2022 8:08]


Crypto currencies gobble up electricity.

Figures for just one of the crypto currencies, Bitcoin:
- Uses more electricity than Norway
- Has a carbon footprint comparable to Greece

https://www.forbes.com/advisor/investing/cryptocurrency/bitcoins-energy-usage-ex

"Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1."

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Energy bills on 14:28 - Aug 30 with 2649 viewsSonofpugwash

The holy grail of electrical engineering has been broadcast power - picking juice up en route in the same way you pick up radio signals.Seems like ultrasound may fit the bill....

https://www.greencars.com/guides/the-future-of-ev-batteries

Poll: Dykes - love him or hate him?

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Energy bills on 14:39 - Aug 30 with 2617 viewshubble

Why renewables can't save the planet - at least according to this environental scientist, and he makes a compelling case:



At the same time, something that could make a difference, and I was pi55ed off when it was ditched (vested interests no doubt), is the Severn barrage tidal power scheme, which - depending who you believe - could contribute up to 10% of the UK's energy needs (and is not limited by weather) - https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/oct/18/severn-barrage-nuclear

However, apparently it's now being reconsidered - unsurprisingly: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/mar/08/severn-estuary-tidal-energy-

Successive UK governments' energy policies have led us to this point. Surely self-sufficiency in energy is of paramount importance? And surely it's better to drill for our own oil and gas, and even dig for coal, than simply import it from another country that does? And when countries like China and India continue to increase their massive pollution contribution to destroying the ecosystem, it's farcical to be pursuing a Net-Zero carbon policy (with highly dubious benefits in the grnd scheme of things), when all it means is that someone else will simply produce more, to compensate for the loss of production? There are much cleaner ways of producing energy these days that aren't necessarily the renewable options. Anyway, the guy in the video explains why renewables are far from the holy grail people think they are.

Poll: Who is your player of the season?

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Energy bills on 14:44 - Aug 30 with 2593 viewsBostonR

This moment has been coming for the last 20yrs. There is going to be some serious short-term pain unless we get some common sense around the table but Russia does not see any sense in that. Whilst I despise Boris he is right when he states Ukraine is paying in blood whilst we see increased energy costs fuelled by a dangerous Russian state.
The west is getting close to cracking the fusion dilemma and it appears the US might be getting very close to getting a working fusion reactor - that is a game changer.
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Energy bills on 14:56 - Aug 30 with 2568 viewsBazzaInTheLoft

Energy bills on 14:44 - Aug 30 by BostonR

This moment has been coming for the last 20yrs. There is going to be some serious short-term pain unless we get some common sense around the table but Russia does not see any sense in that. Whilst I despise Boris he is right when he states Ukraine is paying in blood whilst we see increased energy costs fuelled by a dangerous Russian state.
The west is getting close to cracking the fusion dilemma and it appears the US might be getting very close to getting a working fusion reactor - that is a game changer.


We only import 3% of our energy from Russia but our bills have gone up 54%

They can’t blame the Ukraine crisis. It’s profiteering and poor infrastructure that’s to blame. That’s been going on since 1992.
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Energy bills on 14:58 - Aug 30 with 2977 viewstraininvain

Energy bills on 14:11 - Aug 30 by Sakura

Isn’t the issue over the bill war not a fear that there will be a physical war with UK or Euro countries with the Russians but that they now can’t rely on importing Russian gas as they once did.

If it's just war related in isolation then why isn't that point consistent with the Russian ruble which in contrast has massively strengthened in that time compared to pre invasion?

Isnt it true that it's the energy importing nations who's currency have weakened. Like Europe , Uk and Japan which is consistent with that.

While our interest rates lag the US then this currency weakening only gets worse.

Got to say Baz video was good. Not focusing on the irony in that solar charging video that those wafers were likely made in China fuelled by coal power stations with no environmental controls.

The video is taken in Southern California. Wondering on what the difference might be for someone living somewhere slightly less sunny in the North of England. Do we think it might be a long drive back from away games over Christmas in future if relying on one of those charging stations to get you back


Re Russian ruble, I might be wrong but didn’t Putin restrict and regulate trade of the ruble following the start of the war to the point that it can’t really be traded for other currencies?

It’s not a fair comparison if so because the other currencies you have mentioned can be openly traded whereas the ruble isn’t. So any perceived strengthening of the ruble has been manipulated by Putin and his pals.
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Energy bills on 15:01 - Aug 30 with 2945 viewsstowmarketrange

Energy bills on 14:44 - Aug 30 by BostonR

This moment has been coming for the last 20yrs. There is going to be some serious short-term pain unless we get some common sense around the table but Russia does not see any sense in that. Whilst I despise Boris he is right when he states Ukraine is paying in blood whilst we see increased energy costs fuelled by a dangerous Russian state.
The west is getting close to cracking the fusion dilemma and it appears the US might be getting very close to getting a working fusion reactor - that is a game changer.


When Russia invaded Ukraine in February all the western countries applied sanctions on goods and services concerning Russia,and told us that the Russians would be financially bankrupt with months if we imposed them.I guess they didn’t think it would affect us as much,or they didn’t tell us the truth again?
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Energy bills on 16:03 - Aug 30 with 2822 viewsEsox_Lucius

I have been following this thread with interest since the start as at the end of last year, my wife and I decided to get a PV solar system with inverter and batteries. We were advised at the time that the payback would be approximately 19 years but we still went ahead as we foresaw increases in the future (not to the extent that has actually taken place to be fair) after the last price cap before the latest one, our payback on our expense dropped to a little over 11 years and with the latest one it is almost down to 3 years.
Since the start of January we have used 492.6kWh of electricity from the grid (21% of our total use) and have exported 1.01 MWh back to our supplier.
I would urge anyone who has privately owned home with a South facing garden to invest the money in one of these systems if you can afford it.
IMO, any new build should have a compulsory requirement to have a PV storage system fitted to it, even a communal one where not every roof is South facing. There is so much that can be done to contain our energy production within this country but I have sickening fear that the people who run the country can't see the level of profits they are currently enjoying, and god forbid working class people couldn't be screwed over.

The grass is always greener.

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Energy bills on 16:20 - Aug 30 with 2790 viewsSakura

Energy bills on 14:56 - Aug 30 by BazzaInTheLoft

We only import 3% of our energy from Russia but our bills have gone up 54%

They can’t blame the Ukraine crisis. It’s profiteering and poor infrastructure that’s to blame. That’s been going on since 1992.


What I am wondering is do you actually just not understand or is this more cynical and an attempt to trick other people into being more onside with views around nationalisation

We in the Uk import significant chunk of gas from Norway. Germany used to get majority from Russia but now gets it from Norway. So we are both bidding for that limited supply. Wouldn't seem hard to me to work out why our prices might go up?

If we import LNG from US, Qatar, even Netherlands but now Italy and Germany are bidding for that same limited supply hence upwards pressure consequences for our prices too

Hope others aren't easily tricked into believing such statements

(Separate point on currency controls these now largely removed and over time would have been arbitraged away anyway )
[Post edited 30 Aug 2022 16:22]
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Energy bills on 17:05 - Aug 30 with 2704 viewsBostonR

Energy bills on 14:56 - Aug 30 by BazzaInTheLoft

We only import 3% of our energy from Russia but our bills have gone up 54%

They can’t blame the Ukraine crisis. It’s profiteering and poor infrastructure that’s to blame. That’s been going on since 1992.


Not sure your response is correct with regard to the figures you have mentioned. What’s obvious is that we have a big problem. My post was really centred on the solution which could be nuclear fusion-which is almost a reality.
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