| Share sale 11:34 - Jun 3 with 56649 views | fitzochris |
I understand the shares owned by Chris Dunphy, Bill Goodwin and Paul Hazelhurst have been sold to a US-based concern.
Keep an eye on Companies House over the coming weeks. |  |
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| Share sale on 17:28 - Jun 4 with 2762 views | TalkingSutty |
| Share sale on 16:44 - Jun 4 by 1907 |
If the directors had signed an NDA as part of the transaction then I would be imagine they couldn’t have consulted the supporters trust even if they wanted to? |
Not consulting their own members means the whole set up of a Supporters Trust needs to be called in to question. The Committee are elected by the members to represent them and report back aren’t they? Anyway they weren’t consulted so it’s irrelevant, they were pro- active in contacting the potential investors this morning though so good on them for doing that. |  | | |
| Share sale on 17:34 - Jun 4 with 2734 views | RAFCBLUE |
| Share sale on 16:46 - Jun 4 by 442Dale |
Possibly. How does this statement fit within the terms of a NDA? |
It depends on what the NDA is for 442.
If the NDA is with the club then it's kind of irrelevant.
Here Altman has done a private deal with private shareholders that isn't the club. Unless he had an NDA with Dunphy, Goodwin etc then there is no breach.
Patching the details together, specifically the EGM, the secrecy around needing a new investor but rewriting the articles of association to achieve it may have now being completely usurped.
It looks like Altman is getting a seat at the Boardroom table regardless of whether it is with the blessing of the club.
If there were / are further negotiations going on then they are still within and NDA and the club wouldn't be able to comment on them. |  |
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| Share sale on 17:36 - Jun 4 with 2716 views | isitme |
| Share sale on 17:01 - Jun 4 by SaxonDale |
Just listened to a podcast with Altman about the role of SmarterScout. Few interesting things from the listen:
The use of SmartScout- From what I could gather SmarterScout use the statistics widely available through Opta to help recommend various players based on statistics accrued over the last few seasons. All the obvious stats (and not so obvious!) seem to be explored by the team on how a player is performing but they then process this data to add further context. A very simplified example being a striker in League 2 may have scored 20 goals however when they factor in the standard of defending, goalkeeping, number of shots he had etc they could predict he would only score 6 in League 1. Whilst another player in the same league who had scored less goals in a similar amount of games could be forecasted to be more successful. Altman said this could be due to various variables such as system, role in his previous team, chance conversion etc.
What struck me was how global this network seems to be- he said he had stats on the majority of competitive leagues in the world excluding Africa. Without sounding all Bury it wouldn't surprise me if we see a more international Dale team (at least before Brexit) if this all goes ahead. Seems to me that he believes his system could take a player from the Greek league and give him an accurate idea of performance levels in League 1 (admittedly he only used more high profile examples in the podcast.)
Doesn't seem to be completely dominated by the statistical side of things either- he mentioned the Rooney deal to DC United, which I presume he had a minor role in. Whilst Rooney pretty much performed for DC how the data had predicted he would, they knew he would be a valuable signing because of stuff that data wouldn't show- eg raising professionalism in training and lifting the squad. |
A lot of the more advanced data uses things such as expected goals, packing etc to suppliment the more obvious physical data. |  | | |
| Share sale on 17:42 - Jun 4 with 2671 views | 442Dale |
From this article:
<<“Do you want to get back into a football club or are you exploring other avenues now?
It’s no secret that I’m now part of an investment manager called NYK Capital Management, and our goal is to buy a lower-division club in Europe. We have a small group of investors and have been vetting deals for some time now. We think that one of the best ways to monetize analytics is to go to Europe, buy a lower division club and get promoted. We think that’s a great way to create value for investors. We’ve been researching for about a year and fundraising at the same time, and we’re getting close. Obviously, if we complete a transaction, everyone will know about it!”>>
“monetize analytics”, “great way to create value for investors”. |  |
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| Share sale on 17:46 - Jun 4 with 2647 views | AtThePeake |
| Share sale on 17:01 - Jun 4 by SaxonDale |
Just listened to a podcast with Altman about the role of SmarterScout. Few interesting things from the listen:
The use of SmartScout- From what I could gather SmarterScout use the statistics widely available through Opta to help recommend various players based on statistics accrued over the last few seasons. All the obvious stats (and not so obvious!) seem to be explored by the team on how a player is performing but they then process this data to add further context. A very simplified example being a striker in League 2 may have scored 20 goals however when they factor in the standard of defending, goalkeeping, number of shots he had etc they could predict he would only score 6 in League 1. Whilst another player in the same league who had scored less goals in a similar amount of games could be forecasted to be more successful. Altman said this could be due to various variables such as system, role in his previous team, chance conversion etc.
What struck me was how global this network seems to be- he said he had stats on the majority of competitive leagues in the world excluding Africa. Without sounding all Bury it wouldn't surprise me if we see a more international Dale team (at least before Brexit) if this all goes ahead. Seems to me that he believes his system could take a player from the Greek league and give him an accurate idea of performance levels in League 1 (admittedly he only used more high profile examples in the podcast.)
Doesn't seem to be completely dominated by the statistical side of things either- he mentioned the Rooney deal to DC United, which I presume he had a minor role in. Whilst Rooney pretty much performed for DC how the data had predicted he would, they knew he would be a valuable signing because of stuff that data wouldn't show- eg raising professionalism in training and lifting the squad. |
Do you have a link to the podcast SD?
My company do a lot of work with Opta and have worked with SmarterScout and tested out their system in the past. Having spoken to a few of my colleagues who were involved with the project they were really impressed with the system, particularly with the benchmarking of stats like you mention to predict how players will cope with a step up in divisions. Those who spoke with him were quite complimentary. |  |
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| Share sale on 17:46 - Jun 4 with 2641 views | BartRowou |
Idiot's Guide needed here please.
1. Have these new people got enough shares to ruin the club by themselves?
2. If no, can they team up with others to ruin the club?
Please answer as if you were explaining to a four-year-old. |  |
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| Share sale on 17:47 - Jun 4 with 2634 views | RAFCBLUE |
"But a trip to South Wales from New York, especially midweek, is not cheap, so there were some limits that I perceived."
The Trust should make him an honorary Exile. | |
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| Share sale on 17:48 - Jun 4 with 2629 views | AtThePeake |
| Share sale on 17:42 - Jun 4 by 442Dale |
From this article:
<<“Do you want to get back into a football club or are you exploring other avenues now?
It’s no secret that I’m now part of an investment manager called NYK Capital Management, and our goal is to buy a lower-division club in Europe. We have a small group of investors and have been vetting deals for some time now. We think that one of the best ways to monetize analytics is to go to Europe, buy a lower division club and get promoted. We think that’s a great way to create value for investors. We’ve been researching for about a year and fundraising at the same time, and we’re getting close. Obviously, if we complete a transaction, everyone will know about it!”>>
“monetize analytics”, “great way to create value for investors”. |
I'm sure I've seen this somewhere before!  | |
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| Share sale on 17:49 - Jun 4 with 2626 views | SuddenLad |
| Share sale on 17:46 - Jun 4 by BartRowou |
Idiot's Guide needed here please.
1. Have these new people got enough shares to ruin the club by themselves?
2. If no, can they team up with others to ruin the club?
Please answer as if you were explaining to a four-year-old. |
Q2. Do you mean 'run' or 'ruin' ? |  |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| Share sale on 17:59 - Jun 4 with 2571 views | 442Dale |
| Share sale on 17:48 - Jun 4 by AtThePeake |
I'm sure I've seen this somewhere before! |
Sorry! Totally missed your post.
Interesting to see that the same thing stood out to both of us. | |
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| Share sale on 18:07 - Jun 4 with 2531 views | SaxonDale |
| Share sale on 17:46 - Jun 4 by AtThePeake |
Do you have a link to the podcast SD?
My company do a lot of work with Opta and have worked with SmarterScout and tested out their system in the past. Having spoken to a few of my colleagues who were involved with the project they were really impressed with the system, particularly with the benchmarking of stats like you mention to predict how players will cope with a step up in divisions. Those who spoke with him were quite complimentary. |
Hopefully that works and doesn’t send you to one of my ABBA playlists:
https://open.spotify.com/episode/2Dp9HdIAt6Oob6eyrqBAcU?si=McfN6YGMSvqjB8Gplij1R |  | | |
| Share sale on 18:14 - Jun 4 with 2484 views | electricblue |
I take it they will want to use Dale as a guinea pig for this system and thus in a couple of seasons they will have made a fast buck on selling to other clubs...
One person who may secretly see this as a threat to his job will be BBM even though he will not openly admit it..
If the system says we need this player and BBM says no we need to sign this player and thus creating friction in the club.
This could be a away for them to bring their own yes man in...
One question though..
Why Dale out of all the lower league team in Europe!..
Was Dale a cheaper option with minimum loss involved from the investment group...... |  |
| My all time favourite Dale player Mr Lyndon Symmonds |
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| Share sale on 18:17 - Jun 4 with 2468 views | TalkingSutty |
| Share sale on 18:14 - Jun 4 by electricblue |
I take it they will want to use Dale as a guinea pig for this system and thus in a couple of seasons they will have made a fast buck on selling to other clubs...
One person who may secretly see this as a threat to his job will be BBM even though he will not openly admit it..
If the system says we need this player and BBM says no we need to sign this player and thus creating friction in the club.
This could be a away for them to bring their own yes man in...
One question though..
Why Dale out of all the lower league team in Europe!..
Was Dale a cheaper option with minimum loss involved from the investment group...... |
Majority of lower league clubs carry debts, financially we are in a good place compared to most. | | | |
| Share sale on 18:28 - Jun 4 with 2400 views | AtThePeake |
| Share sale on 18:14 - Jun 4 by electricblue |
I take it they will want to use Dale as a guinea pig for this system and thus in a couple of seasons they will have made a fast buck on selling to other clubs...
One person who may secretly see this as a threat to his job will be BBM even though he will not openly admit it..
If the system says we need this player and BBM says no we need to sign this player and thus creating friction in the club.
This could be a away for them to bring their own yes man in...
One question though..
Why Dale out of all the lower league team in Europe!..
Was Dale a cheaper option with minimum loss involved from the investment group...... |
"If the system says we need this player and BBM says no we need to sign this player and thus creating friction in the club.
This could be a away for them to bring their own yes man in..."
This is exactly what happened at Brentford in the end with Mark Warburton. | |
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| Share sale on 18:37 - Jun 4 with 2360 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Share sale on 17:16 - Jun 4 by funkkk |
I would imagine the long term plan would be for us to have a head coach rather than a manager and the sporting director to effectively be a DoF in charge of transfers. |
Yeah, I can’t envisage how it would work in the ‘ideal’ British model of the owner/board being responsible for finances and negotiation and management being responsible for ‘football’ matters and identifying players. |  |
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| Share sale on 19:01 - Jun 4 with 2268 views | TVOS1907 |
| Share sale on 16:49 - Jun 4 by jonahwhereru |
I wonder what Altman’s scouting system made of Keaton Jennings at the time he signed for us “sorry Keaton who? How are you spelling that? !!!
Personally I think BBM has recruited well, so would like things left to him.
When Taylor suggested Dave McKay to Clough I don’t think he was thinking of future sell on fees. Just getting in a player who could do a job for the team. [Post edited 4 Jun 2020 16:54]
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“How are you spelling that?”
Probably as Mulvey instead of Jennings. |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Share sale on 19:01 - Jun 4 with 2270 views | Daleaholic |
Not comfortable with this. Understand that there's nothing we can do if somebody decides to sell their shares but we only have to look to the last year to see what can happen with the wrong people having their hands on a football club.
I'm sure we'll get more information very soon but all I'm seeing is red flags and horrible visions of Steve (Up The) Dale.
The question that needs to be asked is WHY ROCHDALE? Why have they chosen this club with small crowds and limited honours? We need to be very careful and if necessary, very vocal.
Emre Marcelli...
Works for a company called Lidya
https://www.lidya.co/us/en/about_us/
Someone asked for more info on him too I think? Phone number here if you want to give him a call...
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1580938/000158093813000001/xslFormDX01/p |  |
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| Share sale on 19:13 - Jun 4 with 2219 views | judd |
| Share sale on 19:01 - Jun 4 by Daleaholic |
Not comfortable with this. Understand that there's nothing we can do if somebody decides to sell their shares but we only have to look to the last year to see what can happen with the wrong people having their hands on a football club.
I'm sure we'll get more information very soon but all I'm seeing is red flags and horrible visions of Steve (Up The) Dale.
The question that needs to be asked is WHY ROCHDALE? Why have they chosen this club with small crowds and limited honours? We need to be very careful and if necessary, very vocal.
Emre Marcelli...
Works for a company called Lidya
https://www.lidya.co/us/en/about_us/
Someone asked for more info on him too I think? Phone number here if you want to give him a call...
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1580938/000158093813000001/xslFormDX01/p |
Burys last 2 owners were a deluded property developer and an asset stripper.
This guy Altmans business is professional football. It has to be of long term interest to him in order to prove his model works and for him and his investors to benefit financially.
It is no secret that we have been looking for external investment for some years and so the introduction may have been made some time ago within football circles.
They have not acquired 100% ownership and I am unsure on their desire to do so.
Kieran Maguire has often cited the club as financially well run. We had no debt until recently and own our own stadium. We have a good foundation to build upon. It needs a fresh approach to build on the support base at the current excellent pricing (season tickets) and an attractive, winning team would enhance this.
It's a tall order to boost attendances and their wish to invest in additional commercial staff is joyous to read. |  |
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| Share sale on 19:16 - Jun 4 with 2207 views | TomRAFC |
| Share sale on 19:01 - Jun 4 by Daleaholic |
Not comfortable with this. Understand that there's nothing we can do if somebody decides to sell their shares but we only have to look to the last year to see what can happen with the wrong people having their hands on a football club.
I'm sure we'll get more information very soon but all I'm seeing is red flags and horrible visions of Steve (Up The) Dale.
The question that needs to be asked is WHY ROCHDALE? Why have they chosen this club with small crowds and limited honours? We need to be very careful and if necessary, very vocal.
Emre Marcelli...
Works for a company called Lidya
https://www.lidya.co/us/en/about_us/
Someone asked for more info on him too I think? Phone number here if you want to give him a call...
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1580938/000158093813000001/xslFormDX01/p |
A quick google image search suggests it's a very swanky apartment... | |
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| Share sale on 19:38 - Jun 4 with 2123 views | 49thseason |
Why Rochdale?
1. Easy connections to New York
2. Large football catchment area (for fans, players and academy players)
3. Relatively Debt free
4. Generally well run
5. Excellent Academy reputation
6. History of selling-on players
7. Room for improvement of league position
8. Potential for big gains from relatively small investment (training facilities and pitch )
9. Supportive Local Authority
10. No single person owns a majority shareholding (Chairman owns 110,000)
11. Club needs investment
12, If their analysis system works at Rochdale it could work anywhere, win for them, win for us.
Personally, given the tribulations of the last 3 seasons, I thing this could revitalise the club from top to bottom. I realise many do not like Americans but bringing in a Harvard PhD Economist and an MBA in the US finance industry can only in my view bring some much needed energy and expertise to the club. There have been many who have said the club needs investment, well, here it is, and with more than a passing interest in football. These guys have a vested interest in making Rochdale AFC successful. And if they are successful with their analysis product and RAFC becomes profitable and successful too who knows where they might want to take us? I liked the line "initial investment" in their statement too! These sorts of buses do not come by very often and when you are stood in the rain and one appears.... |  | | |
| Share sale on 19:38 - Jun 4 with 2121 views | TalkingSutty |
| Share sale on 19:13 - Jun 4 by judd |
Burys last 2 owners were a deluded property developer and an asset stripper.
This guy Altmans business is professional football. It has to be of long term interest to him in order to prove his model works and for him and his investors to benefit financially.
It is no secret that we have been looking for external investment for some years and so the introduction may have been made some time ago within football circles.
They have not acquired 100% ownership and I am unsure on their desire to do so.
Kieran Maguire has often cited the club as financially well run. We had no debt until recently and own our own stadium. We have a good foundation to build upon. It needs a fresh approach to build on the support base at the current excellent pricing (season tickets) and an attractive, winning team would enhance this.
It's a tall order to boost attendances and their wish to invest in additional commercial staff is joyous to read. |
The biggest interest to me is that our Chairman and life long supporter Chris Dunphy, alongside previous long standing Director Bill Goodwin have chosen to sell their shares to these individuals. These are people steeped in our Club who have a real love for it, they had a connection with the fans also and that still remains.
No disrespect to our current Chairman in name only because he's probably a nice fella, but he's not really the Chairman is he if we're being honest? Let's get these fellas in and see who they bring on board, they are capable of progressing all areas of our Club and the CEO and Directors said we are desperate for outside investment, well these two seem to have the right credentials, otherwise they wouldn't have been offered Chris Dunphys and others shares to purchase. | | | |
| Share sale on 20:07 - Jun 4 with 1998 views | D_Alien |
| Share sale on 19:38 - Jun 4 by TalkingSutty |
The biggest interest to me is that our Chairman and life long supporter Chris Dunphy, alongside previous long standing Director Bill Goodwin have chosen to sell their shares to these individuals. These are people steeped in our Club who have a real love for it, they had a connection with the fans also and that still remains.
No disrespect to our current Chairman in name only because he's probably a nice fella, but he's not really the Chairman is he if we're being honest? Let's get these fellas in and see who they bring on board, they are capable of progressing all areas of our Club and the CEO and Directors said we are desperate for outside investment, well these two seem to have the right credentials, otherwise they wouldn't have been offered Chris Dunphys and others shares to purchase. |
Fair point about the chairman
Given the circles that Altman is familiar with, he might also want to cast an eye on other significant personnel who currently have what appears to be the run of the club |  |
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| Share sale on 20:24 - Jun 4 with 1925 views | TalkingSutty |
| Share sale on 20:07 - Jun 4 by D_Alien |
Fair point about the chairman
Given the circles that Altman is familiar with, he might also want to cast an eye on other significant personnel who currently have what appears to be the run of the club |
Well full credit to the CEO and other Directors because they have more or less spelt out that we can't carry on without outside investment..They have been actively touting the Club around and are desperate for it. They must be overjoyed with this, financial investment into all areas of the Club, increasing commercial staff etc and two men who come with decent credentials. | | | |
| Share sale on 20:31 - Jun 4 with 1890 views | judd |
I hope this doesn't herald the start of a 301 page 1.2 million views thread on the beardyman board warning us about geeks bearing gifts etc... | |
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