| After 34 games 22:51 - Mar 9 with 8619 views | simmo |
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/championship/formtabelle/wettbewerb/GB2?saison_i
19/20: 34 games, 12 wins, 7 draws, 15 losses, -7 GD, 43pts & 15th
20/21: 34 games, 12 wins, 10 draws, 12 losses, -4 GD, 46pts & 12th
If you just took Eze out of this team you'd say that being in a similar position would be very good going. But Eze plus Bright, Manning, Wells, Hugill (and to a degree) Leistner & Rangel... That's some effort, even in a slightly worse league.
I was very critical of our January window, especially with how slow we were to address key positions, but to a man every addition has hit the ground running and adding them to Dickie and Dieng along with a change of formation has transformed this team and made us all but safe by March. Excellent work.
[Post edited 9 Mar 2021 22:53]
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| ask Beavis I get nothing Butthead |
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| After 34 games on 11:27 - Mar 10 with 2004 views | nix |
| After 34 games on 09:31 - Mar 10 by daveB |
Was the summer window really a balls up?
Carrol, Wilock and Dickie all look good signings. Amos was doing Ok before the injury
Getting Deing on a long term deal looks good business now.
Adomah has been hit and miss so far but not a terrible signing by any means.
Bonne and Dykes were gambles which haven't really worked but wouldn't write them off yet, neither were massive money either. They did try for Moore and Hugil but were unable to get them.
Kellman was one of the development squad so hard to judge yet
George Thomas was a free transfer to fill the squad out, again one who might come good but no big loss if not.
it could have been better but it's a long way from a balls up. The likes of Austin, Johansen and Field were not available back in October.
As for the public display they were stood there having a conversation, you could read it several different ways but they didn't sack him after that game so perhaps we read a bit too much into it. |
Totally this. Plus I think the general consensus WAS that we needed some experience in January. But what's a straw man between friends... |  | | |
| After 34 games on 11:27 - Mar 10 with 2006 views | Tonto |
| After 34 games on 09:31 - Mar 10 by daveB |
Was the summer window really a balls up?
Carrol, Wilock and Dickie all look good signings. Amos was doing Ok before the injury
Getting Deing on a long term deal looks good business now.
Adomah has been hit and miss so far but not a terrible signing by any means.
Bonne and Dykes were gambles which haven't really worked but wouldn't write them off yet, neither were massive money either. They did try for Moore and Hugil but were unable to get them.
Kellman was one of the development squad so hard to judge yet
George Thomas was a free transfer to fill the squad out, again one who might come good but no big loss if not.
it could have been better but it's a long way from a balls up. The likes of Austin, Johansen and Field were not available back in October.
As for the public display they were stood there having a conversation, you could read it several different ways but they didn't sack him after that game so perhaps we read a bit too much into it. |
yeah but that doesnt fit with Steve's opinion that evil Les, Uncle Tony and Hoos are killing our club |  |
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| After 34 games on 11:32 - Mar 10 with 1979 views | nix |
| After 34 games on 11:27 - Mar 10 by Tonto |
yeah but that doesnt fit with Steve's opinion that evil Les, Uncle Tony and Hoos are killing our club |
Yep, ba stards. Keeping us sustainable. Putting money into the club every month (the owners). Developing young players. Turning QPR back into a genuinely community club.
Let's slag them off as much as possible. | | | |
| After 34 games on 11:34 - Mar 10 with 1976 views | Juzzie |
I know it's difficult because as fans we're passionate and want our club to do well but this is why fans need to be patient. It's a marathon not a sprint.
Yes, we went 10 games in December without a win but since Jan 1 we've been the dogs nuts.
People crawling all over social media when things aren't going so well (then nowhere to be seen when they are) doesn't help anyone or anything. if they have personal issues that means they have to take their frustration out on social media, go seek guidance/counselling. |  | | |
| After 34 games on 12:13 - Mar 10 with 1895 views | TheChef |
| After 34 games on 09:31 - Mar 10 by daveB |
Was the summer window really a balls up?
Carrol, Wilock and Dickie all look good signings. Amos was doing Ok before the injury
Getting Deing on a long term deal looks good business now.
Adomah has been hit and miss so far but not a terrible signing by any means.
Bonne and Dykes were gambles which haven't really worked but wouldn't write them off yet, neither were massive money either. They did try for Moore and Hugil but were unable to get them.
Kellman was one of the development squad so hard to judge yet
George Thomas was a free transfer to fill the squad out, again one who might come good but no big loss if not.
it could have been better but it's a long way from a balls up. The likes of Austin, Johansen and Field were not available back in October.
As for the public display they were stood there having a conversation, you could read it several different ways but they didn't sack him after that game so perhaps we read a bit too much into it. |
Good points Dave.
Just checking Moore's stats - 16 goals in 31 games. Shame we couldn't get him but hey ho.
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/kieffer-moore/leistungsdaten/spieler/275590
I'm sure Hugill won't mind being at the top Championship club and getting a nice weekly wedge, but wouldn't he be happier playing more football?
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/jordan-hugill/profil/spieler/291544 |  |
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| After 34 games on 12:54 - Mar 10 with 1826 views | stevec |
| After 34 games on 11:32 - Mar 10 by nix |
Yep, ba stards. Keeping us sustainable. Putting money into the club every month (the owners). Developing young players. Turning QPR back into a genuinely community club.
Let's slag them off as much as possible. |
Be honest Nix, we were a mess before Christmas. We'd tried to approach the new season with an array of cheap and cheerfuls and it backfired spectacularly. Realising the club was on a mission to League One they did what they should have done last summer and got in some experienced players down the spine of the team.
I know they put money into the club every month, I've said that many times in their defence, but it will have cost them a whole lot more rectifying the problem they themselves created at the start of the season.
As for slagging them off as much as possible, I said they've corrected their errors and hopefully they've learned from them. Johansen, Field and Austin are essential for next season, but do the club have the will to carry on this momentum? Time for the club to step up. |  | | |
| After 34 games on 13:35 - Mar 10 with 1760 views | LongsufferingR |
| After 34 games on 09:18 - Mar 10 by toboboly |
I know we couldn't have kept him but imagine having Eze in this team... |
Would he get in the side though?  |  | | |
| After 34 games on 13:42 - Mar 10 with 1741 views | nix |
| After 34 games on 12:54 - Mar 10 by stevec |
Be honest Nix, we were a mess before Christmas. We'd tried to approach the new season with an array of cheap and cheerfuls and it backfired spectacularly. Realising the club was on a mission to League One they did what they should have done last summer and got in some experienced players down the spine of the team.
I know they put money into the club every month, I've said that many times in their defence, but it will have cost them a whole lot more rectifying the problem they themselves created at the start of the season.
As for slagging them off as much as possible, I said they've corrected their errors and hopefully they've learned from them. Johansen, Field and Austin are essential for next season, but do the club have the will to carry on this momentum? Time for the club to step up. |
No I disagree. We had a massive overhaul to make on a shoestring budget. We tried to get various players and were outbid. We did however, get some excellent new signings. It's a work in progress. Some players may not work out when you're in a bargain basement level. Some players may take some time to find their feet. You're not taking any of this into account or the fact that we hardly had any pre-season or time to let the players gel on the training pitch. I said somewhere ago that a solid defence takes time to work together, and that's been proven, plus Warburton working out the best formation.
We couldn't have got Johansen and Austin in the summer. Or probably Field or De Wijs. I'd rather wait than get the wrong players in. Its slightly different with strikers as the finished article is ridiculously expensive. I know Bonne and Dykes aren't totally working out yet but it's an attempt to move things forward
All this tell it how it is bollix gets on my nerves. We could all see we needed some experience after a number of matches, but it's both with the benefit of hindsight and not taking into account who was available, who we could afford and who would come to us.
I don't see the summer as a massive error but as a partial success. I'm delighted they've got Dickie, Willock and Albert in for practically nothing compared to the bad old spend, spend, spend days.
I'm more excited about our future than I've been in years. If you don't see the club as already having stepped up and learnt a shed load of lessons since the Redknapp/Hughes fiasco then I despair. We've got talented players absolutely excited about coming to us. Why do you think you have to teach Warburton, Les and Hoos a lesson? I'm just baffled. Only Barnsley out of the bargain basement group are outperforming us in the table and they've had a season with practically the same squad. QED. | | | |
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| After 34 games on 13:43 - Mar 10 with 1733 views | Gloucs_R |
Great turn around and hats off to Warbs.
Why though, did we start the season thinking we'd be ok with what we had? Have the summer signings just not been good enough? If so, who is to blame for that?
It's brilliant we've now invested in some quality, but the majority of us were screaming out for that at the beginning of the season.
Edit...Dickie had been the only consistent player to have signed in the summer. Willock is coming good. [Post edited 10 Mar 2021 13:47]
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| After 34 games on 13:46 - Mar 10 with 1732 views | derbyhoop |
Any transfers inward you hope to be better than the players being replaced. By that measure the January loanees have delivered in spades:-
Austin better than Dykes - no argument
Field - better than Dom Ball. Certainly looks likely
Johansen - instead of Carroll (?). Offers a goal threat that LTC doesn't
De Wijs - younger and more dominant than Cameron. Too early to judge as he hasn't played a full game whereas Cameron has played 30+
Be nice to keep all 4, however unlikely. |  |
| Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one’s lifetime. (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop |
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| After 34 games on 13:59 - Mar 10 with 1699 views | themodfather |
just having a decent goalie makes the huge difference, then the team feels more confident and results improve ,.the turn around in wins has been remarkable and our form is better and a relief to us all. 3 losses in 13 games is proof of that. also a game in hand could see us dangerously near the top 6. well done to warburton , as i thought he was a goner last novemeber..... |  | | |
| After 34 games on 14:53 - Mar 10 with 1650 views | Tonto |
| After 34 games on 13:46 - Mar 10 by derbyhoop |
Any transfers inward you hope to be better than the players being replaced. By that measure the January loanees have delivered in spades:-
Austin better than Dykes - no argument
Field - better than Dom Ball. Certainly looks likely
Johansen - instead of Carroll (?). Offers a goal threat that LTC doesn't
De Wijs - younger and more dominant than Cameron. Too early to judge as he hasn't played a full game whereas Cameron has played 30+
Be nice to keep all 4, however unlikely. |
2 of them are done deals... the least likely to retain is Austin given the money he is on now. he would need to really love the club to take the big paycut. Unless we can offer him something else as an incentive. | |
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| After 34 games on 07:06 - Mar 11 with 1516 views | nix |
| After 34 games on 13:43 - Mar 10 by Gloucs_R |
Great turn around and hats off to Warbs.
Why though, did we start the season thinking we'd be ok with what we had? Have the summer signings just not been good enough? If so, who is to blame for that?
It's brilliant we've now invested in some quality, but the majority of us were screaming out for that at the beginning of the season.
Edit...Dickie had been the only consistent player to have signed in the summer. Willock is coming good. [Post edited 10 Mar 2021 13:47]
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Why does someone have to be to blame? They don't have crystal balls. It's not an exact science. We' were in a pandemic, where they have to manage their income. Their signings have been significantly better than other clubs who've signed all and sundry, e.g. Notts Forest, Derby.
How could they have signed Charlie and Johansen in the summer when they weren't available? They have a plan, which I believe didn't involve going up this season but using the Eze money to build longer term. I think Willock has looked class from day 1, but needed experience at this level and some physical conditioning. If he hadn't then we wouldn't have got him, so that's an obvious big win. I'm surprised we've got Field in, he's a cracking acquisition but again I don't think he would have been available in the summer. Dickie had much more experience in English football than most of the others, so it's not a surprise that he's doing well.
There's an argument to not going up, Huddersfield style, with players that aren't good enough because you'll have a miserable season and come back straight down again. I like their plan better than your plan because we've tried the spend, spend, spend approach and it was sh*t and we nearly went out of business.
I think we've got a much better chance of getting decent players next season because we won't look like an average team with an Eze and Hughill-size hole in the middle. We'll look like a team with a few decent players and a balanced squad needing a bit of quality to push them up to top six level. We'"ll look like a team that's fun to play in with a decent chance of winning matches with. | | | |
| After 34 games on 07:43 - Mar 11 with 1475 views | Gloucs_R |
| After 34 games on 07:06 - Mar 11 by nix |
Why does someone have to be to blame? They don't have crystal balls. It's not an exact science. We' were in a pandemic, where they have to manage their income. Their signings have been significantly better than other clubs who've signed all and sundry, e.g. Notts Forest, Derby.
How could they have signed Charlie and Johansen in the summer when they weren't available? They have a plan, which I believe didn't involve going up this season but using the Eze money to build longer term. I think Willock has looked class from day 1, but needed experience at this level and some physical conditioning. If he hadn't then we wouldn't have got him, so that's an obvious big win. I'm surprised we've got Field in, he's a cracking acquisition but again I don't think he would have been available in the summer. Dickie had much more experience in English football than most of the others, so it's not a surprise that he's doing well.
There's an argument to not going up, Huddersfield style, with players that aren't good enough because you'll have a miserable season and come back straight down again. I like their plan better than your plan because we've tried the spend, spend, spend approach and it was sh*t and we nearly went out of business.
I think we've got a much better chance of getting decent players next season because we won't look like an average team with an Eze and Hughill-size hole in the middle. We'll look like a team with a few decent players and a balanced squad needing a bit of quality to push them up to top six level. We'"ll look like a team that's fun to play in with a decent chance of winning matches with. |
Because someone has the responsibility of scouting and signing players. Simple.
Therefore, if things don't work out, they are accountable. The only way to learn and improve its to analyse what has gone wrong and what went right.
I think we took too many risks in the summer. Bought three strikers with either no or very little experience. Yes, we're building for the future but the lesson should be that we took it too far. Accept your point that maybe the quality wasn't there and within budget.
Jan signings have been superb.
Id love to know if Warbs thought we had enough to scrape by or predicted this. [Post edited 11 Mar 2021 7:45]
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| After 34 games on 07:54 - Mar 11 with 1468 views | QPROslo |
| After 34 games on 13:42 - Mar 10 by nix |
No I disagree. We had a massive overhaul to make on a shoestring budget. We tried to get various players and were outbid. We did however, get some excellent new signings. It's a work in progress. Some players may not work out when you're in a bargain basement level. Some players may take some time to find their feet. You're not taking any of this into account or the fact that we hardly had any pre-season or time to let the players gel on the training pitch. I said somewhere ago that a solid defence takes time to work together, and that's been proven, plus Warburton working out the best formation.
We couldn't have got Johansen and Austin in the summer. Or probably Field or De Wijs. I'd rather wait than get the wrong players in. Its slightly different with strikers as the finished article is ridiculously expensive. I know Bonne and Dykes aren't totally working out yet but it's an attempt to move things forward
All this tell it how it is bollix gets on my nerves. We could all see we needed some experience after a number of matches, but it's both with the benefit of hindsight and not taking into account who was available, who we could afford and who would come to us.
I don't see the summer as a massive error but as a partial success. I'm delighted they've got Dickie, Willock and Albert in for practically nothing compared to the bad old spend, spend, spend days.
I'm more excited about our future than I've been in years. If you don't see the club as already having stepped up and learnt a shed load of lessons since the Redknapp/Hughes fiasco then I despair. We've got talented players absolutely excited about coming to us. Why do you think you have to teach Warburton, Les and Hoos a lesson? I'm just baffled. Only Barnsley out of the bargain basement group are outperforming us in the table and they've had a season with practically the same squad. QED. |
Nix! I agree, my down arrow was meant to be an up. Sorry! | | | |
| After 34 games on 09:22 - Mar 11 with 1401 views | nix |
| After 34 games on 07:43 - Mar 11 by Gloucs_R |
Because someone has the responsibility of scouting and signing players. Simple.
Therefore, if things don't work out, they are accountable. The only way to learn and improve its to analyse what has gone wrong and what went right.
I think we took too many risks in the summer. Bought three strikers with either no or very little experience. Yes, we're building for the future but the lesson should be that we took it too far. Accept your point that maybe the quality wasn't there and within budget.
Jan signings have been superb.
Id love to know if Warbs thought we had enough to scrape by or predicted this. [Post edited 11 Mar 2021 7:45]
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Fair enough. Although blame doesn't sound to me the same as analysing what went wrong or right. I accept that maybe getting three new strikers in was a risk and it hasn't paid off so far, although I don't think we can judge it definitively or have any real view of Kelman so far. But anyway, if more is going right than wrong, I think it's realistic in such a difficult market to say they're doing a good job.
They tried to get Keifer Moore, but he wouldn't come to us, and probably other strikers the same. As I say, because we've now got a better squad, we're in a much better position next summer to get in the more experienced people who wouldn't have wanted to join a basket case.
But it's good to have these discussions even if we're unlikely to see things the same way!!!
PS no problem Oslo. | | | |
| After 34 games on 09:56 - Mar 11 with 1358 views | W7Ranger |
Is it perhaps worth waiting until the end of the season before dissecting how sh!t or good we/Warbs/the board are?
There's still one or two on this thread slating Warbs/the board for the 1st half of the season, and probably would've had him sacked if they had a choice. Thankfully the board held there nerve and Warbs and his backroom staff have turned it around with the addition of some cracking loan signings (which is some cases will become permanent) and a change in formation, resulting in some really solid performances and even better results. Had the club kneejerked and sacked Warbs like some of the fanbase wanted, who could've come in and equaled or bettered or form since the beginning of the year, and got in the players we have now?? Sacking Warbs back in December could've been a disaster for the club!
A season isn't decided over 22/23 games. And as already stated we're currently ahead (points wise) of where we were after 34 games last season. So with that change around in personal and some bloody good talent leaving the club, that's a phenomenal achievement (so far), and I think Warbs and the Board deserve enormous credit for where we are and where we're (hopefully!) heading. Compare us to some of the other clubs in this division, and we're as steady and stable as we can possibly be in the circumstances. |  | | |
| After 34 games on 11:37 - Mar 11 with 1295 views | E1Hoop |
The Club and Warburton should also be judged against their ambition. If it was to sign players to get promoted this year then Willock, Dykes, Bonne and even Dickie were probably not the answer.
But if the brief was sign young players that can be developed into a top 6 team in 2 to 3 years then they might be great signings.
So to judge Warburton and others at the Club I would need to know what their target was. I think that the aim is more the latter target of 2-3 years. Against that I would say that progress to date is excellent for Dickie and Dieng, encouraging signs for Willock, would probably have wanted more from Adomah and Thomas, unlucky to have lost Amos and Carroll to long term injuries and to date disappointed with Dykes and Bonne.
If Amos had played 20 games and Dykes scored 12 goals I think that the need for loan signings would not have been so desperate. The fact that these have not worked out so far is not something that warrants major action in my view.
So in judging the Club I would say 6/10 but raised to a 7/10 given the continued need for cost cutting. | | | |
| After 34 games on 12:07 - Mar 11 with 1258 views | WatfordR |
Repeating my usual mantra of the Championship being 24 degrees of average. The addition of four loan signings, all better than what we had, moves us from relegation candidates to top ten standard (at least, maybe better).
What we are missing to push right on is the depth to cover any of those four to anywhere close to the same standard. If Dykes/Bonne/Kelman can step up, that's one problem sorted. Do we have enough to cover the other three? Maybe Field and De Wijs on the short term. No one close to Johansen IMO.
If we are going to look for more pace in the team, as Warburton has recently suggested, I'm not sure where that fits in the first XI. Instead of Wallace maybe? Not ahead of Chair. Pace in a frontman is great, but not ahead of the ability to stick chances away. Not so necessary in central midfield.
Anyway, fairly happy where we are at the moment, and if we could convert all four loans to perm, that would be a step forward I think. |  | | |
| After 34 games on 12:40 - Mar 11 with 1217 views | TheChef |
I wonder at what point Warbs is offered a new contract, given the current one expires in June (assuming he hasn't already). | |
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| After 34 games on 12:41 - Mar 11 with 1214 views | WatfordR |
| After 34 games on 12:40 - Mar 11 by TheChef |
I wonder at what point Warbs is offered a new contract, given the current one expires in June (assuming he hasn't already). |
Obviously no idea, but it's interesting that he's been talking about what we need for next season. | | | |
| After 34 games on 12:49 - Mar 11 with 1203 views | SouthCoastR |
| After 34 games on 12:40 - Mar 11 by TheChef |
I wonder at what point Warbs is offered a new contract, given the current one expires in June (assuming he hasn't already). |
I believe that Warbs is on a rolling contract, not sure it does expire this summer | | | |
| After 34 games on 12:54 - Mar 11 with 1193 views | simmo |
I think the key to consistency is keeping the existing talent and then building. But will we be forced to sell at least 1 in the summer, or is our wage bill now manageable enough that we can retain the players we have for another season at least?
I think on current form, Dickie and Dieng will both be hard to hold onto this year. Both have rare skill sets and are well suited for a step up, Although both have a long time to go so we have the power to hold out for a relatively big fee. Chair I think will stay at least another year and that's about it for players in big demand.
As for the loans, it would be great to keep them all on. De Wijs and Field look sewn up if we like (and it's still VERY early days for Jordy, so let's wait and see more on that one), but Johansen and Austin will rely massively on stars aligning and the players making big financial compromises. How often does that actually happen, realistically? Have there been many examples of Championship teams keeping thier successful PL loans without promotion? | |
| ask Beavis I get nothing Butthead |
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| After 34 games on 13:03 - Mar 11 with 1175 views | ted_hendrix |
| After 34 games on 12:54 - Mar 11 by simmo |
I think the key to consistency is keeping the existing talent and then building. But will we be forced to sell at least 1 in the summer, or is our wage bill now manageable enough that we can retain the players we have for another season at least?
I think on current form, Dickie and Dieng will both be hard to hold onto this year. Both have rare skill sets and are well suited for a step up, Although both have a long time to go so we have the power to hold out for a relatively big fee. Chair I think will stay at least another year and that's about it for players in big demand.
As for the loans, it would be great to keep them all on. De Wijs and Field look sewn up if we like (and it's still VERY early days for Jordy, so let's wait and see more on that one), but Johansen and Austin will rely massively on stars aligning and the players making big financial compromises. How often does that actually happen, realistically? Have there been many examples of Championship teams keeping thier successful PL loans without promotion? |
*I think on current form, Dickie and Dieng will both be hard to hold onto this year. Both have rare skill sets and are well suited for a step up, Although both have a long time to go so we have the power to hold out for a relatively big fee. Chair I think will stay at least another year and that's about it for players in big demand.*
FWIW;
Dickie has been my signing of the season-Chair is the one player who worries me, I got this horrible feeling that he'll get sold at the end of the season, we are after all a 'selling' club people don't like that phrase but it's a fact-horrible as it is.
We've got a great squad together at the moment (at long last). |  |
| My Father had a profound influence on me, he was a lunatic. |
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| After 34 games on 13:56 - Mar 11 with 1114 views | simmo |
I think the problem with Chair is that, with his size, he has to be a pretty exceptional talent to move into the Premiership. Teams can generally have 1 or maybe 2 number 10 style technicians at a push and which PL team will be making Chair that man? I love him; he works hard, always gives his all, has a beautiful touch and can ping a shot from 25 yards as well as anyone - but 7 goals 1 assist (even if that last stat is bollocks) isn't going to be enough to propel him...
Maybe another Championship club higher and with more resources than us would take him, but then it wouldn't be the big money we're after. I think another season here at least makes the most sense. He plays in front of the fans again, can improve his decision making and end product, get another 50 odd games under his belt and show he's outgrown us. At the moment I am not sure he can claim that. | |
| ask Beavis I get nothing Butthead |
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