| Post office / Horizon show 19:46 - Jan 2 with 35582 views | RangersDave |
Christ, what great 'real' drama.
When i first heard about Horizon, waaaay back in the day, and even then with my rudimentary understanding of glitches, viruses, 'computer says no' etc, i knew there was something wildly 'fishy' about it.
Thoroughly recommend it to you all. |  |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 16:31 - Jan 9 with 2735 views | SheffieldHoop |
| Post office / Horizon show on 16:13 - Jan 9 by daveB |
Yeah I think the first case was late 90's which was pre dates Crozier I think, he joined around 2004 from memory although might be wrong, no idea what Crozier knew or didn't know to be honest but the show was focusing more on the court cases which were later when they could have just admitted the error but continued to go after these people. It's a bit of a stretch to blame ITV for what Paula Vennels did, again this is all in the public domain, there was nothing in that drama that wasn't public knowledge already. Some of the script was taken directly out of public records
Not sure what you mean about the social media thing, is that this Joey Barton row? I've tried to ignore it to be honest but think they responded due to the amount of abuse the 2 pundits were getting on the back of joeys tweets |
But will they address the abuse Paula Vennells is undoubtedly getting off the back of their show? Absolutely no chance. |  |
| "Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 16:45 - Jan 9 with 2680 views | daveB |
| Post office / Horizon show on 16:31 - Jan 9 by SheffieldHoop |
But will they address the abuse Paula Vennells is undoubtedly getting off the back of their show? Absolutely no chance. |
what abuse is she getting?
Not sure any criticism of her is down to the show, it's down to what actually happened. It's not like it was a storyline in Coronation Street and people are angry with the actress |  | | |
| Post office / Horizon show on 16:53 - Jan 9 with 2662 views | SheffieldHoop |
| Post office / Horizon show on 16:45 - Jan 9 by daveB |
what abuse is she getting?
Not sure any criticism of her is down to the show, it's down to what actually happened. It's not like it was a storyline in Coronation Street and people are angry with the actress |
Same with the pundits though, surely? Not sure it's down to Joey Barton that they didn't know the player's names. He's just joined in the piss-taking. ITV chooses to call it abuse. It's pathetic. Own your feedback. | |
| "Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 17:18 - Jan 9 with 2616 views | daveB |
| Post office / Horizon show on 16:53 - Jan 9 by SheffieldHoop |
Same with the pundits though, surely? Not sure it's down to Joey Barton that they didn't know the player's names. He's just joined in the piss-taking. ITV chooses to call it abuse. It's pathetic. Own your feedback. |
I don't really want to get into the Joey Barton thing, he compared them to serial killers and the abuse came more from his followers than him but was due to his actions so as they were working for ITV they felt they should say something.
The two stories are really not comparable | | | |
| Post office / Horizon show on 17:20 - Jan 9 with 2604 views | SheffieldHoop |
| Post office / Horizon show on 17:18 - Jan 9 by daveB |
I don't really want to get into the Joey Barton thing, he compared them to serial killers and the abuse came more from his followers than him but was due to his actions so as they were working for ITV they felt they should say something.
The two stories are really not comparable |
I mean, ITV has whipped the public up into posting stuff like this online
I think they absolutely are comparable. | |
| "Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 17:40 - Jan 9 with 2550 views | terryb |
| Post office / Horizon show on 17:20 - Jan 9 by SheffieldHoop |
I mean, ITV has whipped the public up into posting stuff like this online
I think they absolutely are comparable. |
They may have some similarity on social media, but it is the establishment that has turned on Paula Vennells rather than ITV.
Would the government have taken this stance over a television program if it wasn't an election year? They could have done so at any point since the 2016 court case but chose to protect her & the Post Office.
It now suits to distance themselves from the company & the people involved. |  | | |
| Post office / Horizon show on 17:49 - Jan 9 with 2547 views | daveB |
| Post office / Horizon show on 17:20 - Jan 9 by SheffieldHoop |
I mean, ITV has whipped the public up into posting stuff like this online
I think they absolutely are comparable. |
if you want to blame ITV for whipping the public up thats fair enough, as a public broadcaster it's part of their job to shine a light on real life issues like this. If this has woken people up to the story then good, thats what they should be doing
the post office scandal and what has gone on over 20 years is in no way comparable imo to a former footballer having a rant about women on social media and being called out for it. No one will be going to prison or losing their home over a social media row | | | |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 17:51 - Jan 9 with 2525 views | SheffieldHoop |
| Post office / Horizon show on 17:40 - Jan 9 by terryb |
They may have some similarity on social media, but it is the establishment that has turned on Paula Vennells rather than ITV.
Would the government have taken this stance over a television program if it wasn't an election year? They could have done so at any point since the 2016 court case but chose to protect her & the Post Office.
It now suits to distance themselves from the company & the people involved. |
By that logic, ITV is a functioning part of the establishment. Apparently even more so than the BBC these days. | |
| "Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 18:03 - Jan 9 with 2489 views | SheffieldHoop |
| Post office / Horizon show on 17:49 - Jan 9 by daveB |
if you want to blame ITV for whipping the public up thats fair enough, as a public broadcaster it's part of their job to shine a light on real life issues like this. If this has woken people up to the story then good, thats what they should be doing
the post office scandal and what has gone on over 20 years is in no way comparable imo to a former footballer having a rant about women on social media and being called out for it. No one will be going to prison or losing their home over a social media row |
"No one will be going to prison or losing their home over a social media row"
Haha yeah, tell that to your colleagues currently pleading with ITV to begin legal action against him.
No you're right, ITV has treated the ex-footballer making comments about mistakes made by unqualified pundits as a highly serious issue worth referring to lawyers and posting official statements about. Whereas they've made a tv show about the scandal which conveniently attempts to place most of the blame on a woman who joined the post office around 10 years after it was initially informed of the issue, rather than the ex-ITV CEO who was very much around the Post office at key stages in the whole scandal. When said woman is subjected to abuse and death threats on twitter, ITV doesn't want to comment. Is it because they've instigated the pile-on?
Yeah, the 2 stories aren't really comparable in themselves. What is comparable is the way ITV chooses to address it. | |
| "Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 18:22 - Jan 9 with 2429 views | Hooping_Mad |
| Post office / Horizon show on 18:03 - Jan 9 by SheffieldHoop |
"No one will be going to prison or losing their home over a social media row"
Haha yeah, tell that to your colleagues currently pleading with ITV to begin legal action against him.
No you're right, ITV has treated the ex-footballer making comments about mistakes made by unqualified pundits as a highly serious issue worth referring to lawyers and posting official statements about. Whereas they've made a tv show about the scandal which conveniently attempts to place most of the blame on a woman who joined the post office around 10 years after it was initially informed of the issue, rather than the ex-ITV CEO who was very much around the Post office at key stages in the whole scandal. When said woman is subjected to abuse and death threats on twitter, ITV doesn't want to comment. Is it because they've instigated the pile-on?
Yeah, the 2 stories aren't really comparable in themselves. What is comparable is the way ITV chooses to address it. |
Honest mistakes were made, but Vennells' mistakes were not honest, she was head of the post office when they instructed the independent investigation (Second Sight) to stop and destroy all evidence of wrong doing.
She then issued her own report stating that everything is fine.
Lets not forget this individual was an ordained minister in the Church of England and knowingly allowed others to carry the can rather do her job correctly or stand down if she was unable.
Some of those 'others' took their lives because of the actions of this individual.
Do unto others... | |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 19:08 - Jan 9 with 2340 views | SheffieldHoop |
| Post office / Horizon show on 18:22 - Jan 9 by Hooping_Mad |
Honest mistakes were made, but Vennells' mistakes were not honest, she was head of the post office when they instructed the independent investigation (Second Sight) to stop and destroy all evidence of wrong doing.
She then issued her own report stating that everything is fine.
Lets not forget this individual was an ordained minister in the Church of England and knowingly allowed others to carry the can rather do her job correctly or stand down if she was unable.
Some of those 'others' took their lives because of the actions of this individual.
Do unto others... |
Surely at some point in the 10 years before Vennells joined the post office, this should've been fished out? More than 100 prosecutions based on faulty Horizon data in three years between 2000 and 2002. Surely you cannot still be blaming this on honest mistakes by 2012. Surely.
I also see a lot of people mentioning the Church of England in amongst this. If she was from another religion, would it be fair to make that association? Different people are held to different standards. But that's another story for another day. | |
| "Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 19:27 - Jan 9 with 2311 views | kensalriser |
| Post office / Horizon show on 17:40 - Jan 9 by terryb |
They may have some similarity on social media, but it is the establishment that has turned on Paula Vennells rather than ITV.
Would the government have taken this stance over a television program if it wasn't an election year? They could have done so at any point since the 2016 court case but chose to protect her & the Post Office.
It now suits to distance themselves from the company & the people involved. |
The government has known for years about this, as have many other people, but it's part of an established pattern of choosing not to act until there's public uproar. Same as it ever was, vested interest and privilege always protects its own. |  |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 20:23 - Jan 9 with 2262 views | daveB |
| Post office / Horizon show on 18:03 - Jan 9 by SheffieldHoop |
"No one will be going to prison or losing their home over a social media row"
Haha yeah, tell that to your colleagues currently pleading with ITV to begin legal action against him.
No you're right, ITV has treated the ex-footballer making comments about mistakes made by unqualified pundits as a highly serious issue worth referring to lawyers and posting official statements about. Whereas they've made a tv show about the scandal which conveniently attempts to place most of the blame on a woman who joined the post office around 10 years after it was initially informed of the issue, rather than the ex-ITV CEO who was very much around the Post office at key stages in the whole scandal. When said woman is subjected to abuse and death threats on twitter, ITV doesn't want to comment. Is it because they've instigated the pile-on?
Yeah, the 2 stories aren't really comparable in themselves. What is comparable is the way ITV chooses to address it. |
None of the people I work with are pleading with ITV about legal action, to be honest no one i work with has even mentioned Joey been more taking the piss out of the Arsenal fans all week so not really sure what thats all about.
if you watched that drama and came to the conclusion that ITV are the bad guys then fair play, dramas are there to be interpreted as you wish, each to their own and all that. As I say nothing has been hidden, the information on what happened has been there during the last 20 years, if the drama covered every single thing it would have been a 24 part series and probably a bit dull | | | |
| Post office / Horizon show on 21:12 - Jan 9 with 2184 views | Watford_Ranger |
| Post office / Horizon show on 17:20 - Jan 9 by SheffieldHoop |
I mean, ITV has whipped the public up into posting stuff like this online
I think they absolutely are comparable. |
Probably one of the saner Twitter posts I’ve seen today. Don’t see much wrong with it tbh. | | | |
| Post office / Horizon show on 19:17 - Jan 10 with 1713 views | numptydumpty |
He turned down an OBE as he was against the crooked "titles for the boys and girls" system that creates honours for mates of the establishment.
He would not want an honour as it means nothing.
The man is only interested in justice and all power to him for that. |  |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 19:22 - Jan 10 with 1706 views | Mick_S |
| Post office / Horizon show on 19:17 - Jan 10 by numptydumpty |
He turned down an OBE as he was against the crooked "titles for the boys and girls" system that creates honours for mates of the establishment.
He would not want an honour as it means nothing.
The man is only interested in justice and all power to him for that. |
I didn’t realise that. I thought earlier in this post that he wouldn’t accept a medal for this. |  |
| Did I ever mention that I was in Minder? |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 19:37 - Jan 10 with 1689 views | johann28 |
Another Private Eye reader here - been following this story for years, and pleased that it's finally got the attention it deserves.
Some chilling stats at the end of the final episode says it all:
* The PO blamed over 3500 postmasters for financial losses caused by Horizon.
* 700 were found guilty of crimes. 236 were sent to prison. 4 committed suicide.
* The Court of Appeal has so far overturned 93 wrongful convictions.
* Of the 555 allies who fought alongside Bates in the High Court, 18 have since died without seeing justice done.
AND FINALLY - NOT A SINGLE CURRENT OR PREVIOUS PO MANAGER HAS FACED A CRMINAL CHARGE [Post edited 10 Jan 19:38]
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| Post office / Horizon show on 19:43 - Jan 10 with 1661 views | Northernr |
| Post office / Horizon show on 19:37 - Jan 10 by johann28 |
Another Private Eye reader here - been following this story for years, and pleased that it's finally got the attention it deserves.
Some chilling stats at the end of the final episode says it all:
* The PO blamed over 3500 postmasters for financial losses caused by Horizon.
* 700 were found guilty of crimes. 236 were sent to prison. 4 committed suicide.
* The Court of Appeal has so far overturned 93 wrongful convictions.
* Of the 555 allies who fought alongside Bates in the High Court, 18 have since died without seeing justice done.
AND FINALLY - NOT A SINGLE CURRENT OR PREVIOUS PO MANAGER HAS FACED A CRMINAL CHARGE [Post edited 10 Jan 19:38]
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It still boggles my mind that you can get to a point where you're pursuing 3,500 postmasters for thieving without thinking 'hang on a minute'. |  | | |
| Post office / Horizon show on 19:46 - Jan 10 with 1644 views | Mick_S |
| Post office / Horizon show on 19:43 - Jan 10 by Northernr |
It still boggles my mind that you can get to a point where you're pursuing 3,500 postmasters for thieving without thinking 'hang on a minute'. |
Yep. We know nothing. | |
| Did I ever mention that I was in Minder? |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 19:49 - Jan 10 with 1633 views | joe90 |
| Post office / Horizon show on 16:31 - Jan 9 by SheffieldHoop |
But will they address the abuse Paula Vennells is undoubtedly getting off the back of their show? Absolutely no chance. |
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| Post office / Horizon show on 20:02 - Jan 10 with 1610 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
How they got away with it:
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