| Liverpool 17:48 - Aug 4 with 10562 views | Daleaholic |
Appears we may be playing Liverpool tomorrow...? Behind closed doors or part of the 'fun day'?
Tweet from George Donnelly:
"Can't wait to play Liverpool tomorrow!☺⚽Gonna be running & defending for non stop 90mins! Gonna be hard but what a experience!" |  |
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| Liverpool on 22:20 - Aug 5 with 1812 views | 442Dale |
| Liverpool on 22:19 - Aug 5 by olympicdale |
always seemed a top bloke from last season, good to see he actually is. |
He chose Dale ahead of interest from Barnsley and other clubs higher up apparently - wanted first team football and really likes the club. |  |
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| Liverpool on 22:27 - Aug 5 with 1755 views | TalkingSutty |
| Liverpool on 21:31 - Aug 5 by SuddenLad |
But does anyone take any notice ? It's OK being full of great ideas and good intent, but it's a two-way thing. Someone in the Boardroom has to respond with more than lip service.
I've come to the conclusion that the Trust are banging their collective heads against the wall and we members are all paying for the privilege of hearing the thud.
I richly applaud the efforts of the Trust and I don't dispute that they work tirelessly for the benefit of supporters, but I don't get the impression that it makes much difference. |
I think you have a point with your post but if you hit the wall long enough sometimes it starts to crumble. Personally i would rather we have a supporters trust than not have one, for some clubs it has proved to be a vital lifeline in their hour of need. |  | | |
| Liverpool on 23:25 - Aug 5 with 1665 views | R17ALE |
| Liverpool on 21:04 - Aug 5 by SalwaDale |
You are completely correct in all you say. I certainly have no issue with the trust and completely respect all they do. However, I am disappointed that the club doesn't value the trust highly enough (in my opinion). The money thing , the think tank and other issues do lead me to think the club isn't allowing the trust to do as much good for the club as it could. |
We despair!
a) Raise us £30k for a training facility. So we did.
b) Scrap that, we want pitch covers. So we called an EGM and secured the vote.
c) Now the pitch covers won't happen despite hours put in by the Trust to secure quotes etc. The club haven't actually told us yet, we've worked it out! We're waiting for the next white elephant to ride into town!
d) We offered a rotating 2 of us to join the board to help the Commercial Department get back on their feet. We made the point we didn't want Director privileges, just a chance to give our time and expertise to benefit the club. 2 months later we are still waiting for a yes or no!
e) The club feels it is well run off the pitch and "things aren't as bad as you think".
f) I can't be arsed anymore! Sudden Lad is right, but I suspect he wishes he was wrong!
g) Ask for a fixture poster in the shop. The person who should have produced it didn't as he couldn't be arsed. (And I have actually been told that!) [Post edited 1 Jan 1970 1:00]
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| Liverpool on 23:38 - Aug 5 with 1633 views | pl56 |
| Liverpool on 23:25 - Aug 5 by R17ALE |
We despair!
a) Raise us £30k for a training facility. So we did.
b) Scrap that, we want pitch covers. So we called an EGM and secured the vote.
c) Now the pitch covers won't happen despite hours put in by the Trust to secure quotes etc. The club haven't actually told us yet, we've worked it out! We're waiting for the next white elephant to ride into town!
d) We offered a rotating 2 of us to join the board to help the Commercial Department get back on their feet. We made the point we didn't want Director privileges, just a chance to give our time and expertise to benefit the club. 2 months later we are still waiting for a yes or no!
e) The club feels it is well run off the pitch and "things aren't as bad as you think".
f) I can't be arsed anymore! Sudden Lad is right, but I suspect he wishes he was wrong!
g) Ask for a fixture poster in the shop. The person who should have produced it didn't as he couldn't be arsed. (And I have actually been told that!) [Post edited 1 Jan 1970 1:00]
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Thank you for your efforts .
However the end result is that I am more depressed than ever .
With regards to point e) of your post , are these people on a different planet ? I can't claim to have made the kind of generous offers that you have , but for God's sake ....... the failures in strategy , marketing and communications are there for all to see for anybody with any kind of background in managing a business . I despair along with you ! |  | | |
| Liverpool on 23:39 - Aug 5 with 1625 views | R17ALE |
| Liverpool on 23:38 - Aug 5 by pl56 |
Thank you for your efforts .
However the end result is that I am more depressed than ever .
With regards to point e) of your post , are these people on a different planet ? I can't claim to have made the kind of generous offers that you have , but for God's sake ....... the failures in strategy , marketing and communications are there for all to see for anybody with any kind of background in managing a business . I despair along with you ! |
That is the first thank you we have had. I'm welling up!!!! | |
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| Liverpool on 23:41 - Aug 5 with 1616 views | Shun |
| Liverpool on 22:20 - Aug 5 by 442Dale |
He chose Dale ahead of interest from Barnsley and other clubs higher up apparently - wanted first team football and really likes the club. |
Great to hear. |  | | |
| Liverpool on 23:44 - Aug 5 with 1606 views | Thacks_Rabbits |
| Liverpool on 23:25 - Aug 5 by R17ALE |
We despair!
a) Raise us £30k for a training facility. So we did.
b) Scrap that, we want pitch covers. So we called an EGM and secured the vote.
c) Now the pitch covers won't happen despite hours put in by the Trust to secure quotes etc. The club haven't actually told us yet, we've worked it out! We're waiting for the next white elephant to ride into town!
d) We offered a rotating 2 of us to join the board to help the Commercial Department get back on their feet. We made the point we didn't want Director privileges, just a chance to give our time and expertise to benefit the club. 2 months later we are still waiting for a yes or no!
e) The club feels it is well run off the pitch and "things aren't as bad as you think".
f) I can't be arsed anymore! Sudden Lad is right, but I suspect he wishes he was wrong!
g) Ask for a fixture poster in the shop. The person who should have produced it didn't as he couldn't be arsed. (And I have actually been told that!) [Post edited 1 Jan 1970 1:00]
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Razz - Your totally correct - Since Les went, and yourself and Richard its gone downhill totally.
I always remember Les telling me that "If you want a proper job - you dont want to be a commercial manager at Rochdale" 20 - years ago that must have been but how bloody true!!!!
In the same way they throw 80k a year at a player to show ambition - why not do the same with the marketing of the club - even if its based on returns!!!!
Hand on heart if they said - here is 40k a year - make us 400k more than we do now - it would not be an issue - The same would apply if they gave you the role and freedom to manage the place properly.
I would offer my services - 17 years expirience in financial services and great knowledge of marketing - you think I will get a message off C.D.???? - And yet I think I can raise the club £360k per year pre tax more, per year.
Bit of a no brainer really!!!!
BTW ty TBBT - I dont do twitter but thats yet another option that the club dont use!!!!!! |  |
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| Liverpool on 23:46 - Aug 5 with 1597 views | pl56 |
| Liverpool on 21:18 - Aug 5 by TalkingSutty |
Every fan who joins the trust makes us (the fans) stronger. If anybody feels we are being taken for granted by the club and our voice isnt being heard then the best thing they can do is pay a tenner for the year and sign up.
The guarantee is that the committee and all members are dyed in the wool Dale fans who want the best for the club ( That was the reason i joined). Of all seasons, this is the one to make the effort to join or renew membership. Together we are strong !! |
Hang on ... didn't you post earlier that "fans were being treated with contempt by everybody associated with the club" and "I am seriously thinking of packing in" ?
In comparison Wigandale's lack of commitment to the Trust seems somewhat mild .
If you're thinking of packing in your support for the Club (my interpretation of your earlier comment) , then I assume you will also "pack in" any involvement with the Trust ? | | | |
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| Liverpool on 11:44 - Aug 6 with 1445 views | D_Alien |
| Liverpool on 21:31 - Aug 5 by SuddenLad |
But does anyone take any notice ? It's OK being full of great ideas and good intent, but it's a two-way thing. Someone in the Boardroom has to respond with more than lip service.
I've come to the conclusion that the Trust are banging their collective heads against the wall and we members are all paying for the privilege of hearing the thud.
I richly applaud the efforts of the Trust and I don't dispute that they work tirelessly for the benefit of supporters, but I don't get the impression that it makes much difference. |
You've perfectly summed up the position there, SL
I've neither renewed my ST, or my Trust membership. Anyone who's read these boards over the past few years will know how passionate I am about the Dale (sometimes to a fault!) but right now I'll be thinking carefully about every £ spent.
No-one in their right mind would continue giving their custom to a shop where the management (and I mean the board, not JC) treated you with utter contempt, where no attempt was made to make the experience an enjoyable one and where the advertising basically amounted to "take it or leave it"
Many will be leaving it, I'm afraid.
If long-standing diehards are feeling like this, where are the future diehards going to come from?
To sum up: Dale board - change your ways, or the the club has no future. |  |
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| Liverpool on 12:35 - Aug 6 with 1342 views | SFD |
| Liverpool on 11:44 - Aug 6 by D_Alien |
You've perfectly summed up the position there, SL
I've neither renewed my ST, or my Trust membership. Anyone who's read these boards over the past few years will know how passionate I am about the Dale (sometimes to a fault!) but right now I'll be thinking carefully about every £ spent.
No-one in their right mind would continue giving their custom to a shop where the management (and I mean the board, not JC) treated you with utter contempt, where no attempt was made to make the experience an enjoyable one and where the advertising basically amounted to "take it or leave it"
Many will be leaving it, I'm afraid.
If long-standing diehards are feeling like this, where are the future diehards going to come from?
To sum up: Dale board - change your ways, or the the club has no future. |
I feel pretty much the same, gave up the Gold Bond not even a member now (q Judd) and as of yet not purchased a season ticket for any of the family or myself.
I do intend to rejoin the Trust and will do so this week as it is quite clear these are the only people with any know how and desire to move the club forward.
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| Liverpool on 12:37 - Aug 6 with 1335 views | SuddenLad |
| Liverpool on 11:44 - Aug 6 by D_Alien |
You've perfectly summed up the position there, SL
I've neither renewed my ST, or my Trust membership. Anyone who's read these boards over the past few years will know how passionate I am about the Dale (sometimes to a fault!) but right now I'll be thinking carefully about every £ spent.
No-one in their right mind would continue giving their custom to a shop where the management (and I mean the board, not JC) treated you with utter contempt, where no attempt was made to make the experience an enjoyable one and where the advertising basically amounted to "take it or leave it"
Many will be leaving it, I'm afraid.
If long-standing diehards are feeling like this, where are the future diehards going to come from?
To sum up: Dale board - change your ways, or the the club has no future. |
For the record, there are 3 of us here who haven't renewed season tickets, nor will we be doing so - not because of League position but because we no longer feel valued either as customers or as individuals.
We have to seriously consider whether spending an aggregate sum in the region of £1,000 can be justified. In terms of pursuing our passion for Dale my heart has always ruled my head. I wouldn't normally think twice. I suspect many other Dale fans could tell the same story. This is the first time in many years that I haven't bought one.
Regrettably however, the lure of a free burger (unavailable in the main stand) or a free cup of tea/coffee have failed to encourage us to part with our cash.
This time, we have had to take a far deeper look at whether we want to commit the funds.
The fact is that there are now too many 'negatives' associated with attending matches at Spotland. What for years has been a pleasure is increasingly becoming a chore. People are taking good money off us week in, week out without so much as a smile or a 'thank you'. Some club employees speak to you as though you are a turd and it gets increasingly monotonous.
The stewards need to remember that they are not prison warders and that we are not all criminals and we don't deserve to be treated as such, or spoken to as though we are on 'day release'. Just one example: the treatment of the visiting German supporters who attended the Oldham game last year was a disgrace and I was embarrassed for them. Simply taking pictures of a memorable day out and they were threatened with confiscation of their cameras and being ejected from the ground. Utterly shameful.
Sure, there are some great people at the club who are a pleasure to know and to deal with, but many of those 'on the front line' need to 'up' their inter-personal skills rapidly or they will lose 'customers' faster than a pork butcher at a synagogue.
I shall continue to support the team and the club. I shall continue to commit the usual funds to the Gold Bond and Dale Trust. (Won a tenner recently and bought a new shirt, so the club got that back as well !) I shall probably (but not definitely) attend games on an ad-hoc basis when I feel like it, but unless those 'upstairs' sort out the PR mess, the club will lose it's life-blood.
It's taken me 50-odd years of supporting Dale to get to this stage, but I won't be treated like a cash-cow and then be taken for granted.
It seems that once they've got your money you don't count. All I ask for is some respect and consideration. Sadly, both are seriously lacking. |  |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| Liverpool on 13:27 - Aug 6 with 1262 views | 442Dale |
These posts should be alarming in the extreme to everyone at the club. If the chairman is asked at the forum on Thursday if he is aware of the feelings being expressed on this messageboard, should his response be one of concern too?
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| Liverpool on 13:28 - Aug 6 with 1252 views | isitme |
| Liverpool on 13:27 - Aug 6 by 442Dale |
These posts should be alarming in the extreme to everyone at the club. If the chairman is asked at the forum on Thursday if he is aware of the feelings being expressed on this messageboard, should his response be one of concern too?
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He would be in a no win situation with his answer.
If he does then what is he doing about it?
If he doesn't then why is he not aware about it? |  | | |
| Liverpool on 13:35 - Aug 6 with 1230 views | 442Dale |
| Liverpool on 13:28 - Aug 6 by isitme |
He would be in a no win situation with his answer.
If he does then what is he doing about it?
If he doesn't then why is he not aware about it? |
Which is why we are where we are. | |
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| Liverpool on 13:37 - Aug 6 with 1225 views | electricblue |
| Liverpool on 12:37 - Aug 6 by SuddenLad |
For the record, there are 3 of us here who haven't renewed season tickets, nor will we be doing so - not because of League position but because we no longer feel valued either as customers or as individuals.
We have to seriously consider whether spending an aggregate sum in the region of £1,000 can be justified. In terms of pursuing our passion for Dale my heart has always ruled my head. I wouldn't normally think twice. I suspect many other Dale fans could tell the same story. This is the first time in many years that I haven't bought one.
Regrettably however, the lure of a free burger (unavailable in the main stand) or a free cup of tea/coffee have failed to encourage us to part with our cash.
This time, we have had to take a far deeper look at whether we want to commit the funds.
The fact is that there are now too many 'negatives' associated with attending matches at Spotland. What for years has been a pleasure is increasingly becoming a chore. People are taking good money off us week in, week out without so much as a smile or a 'thank you'. Some club employees speak to you as though you are a turd and it gets increasingly monotonous.
The stewards need to remember that they are not prison warders and that we are not all criminals and we don't deserve to be treated as such, or spoken to as though we are on 'day release'. Just one example: the treatment of the visiting German supporters who attended the Oldham game last year was a disgrace and I was embarrassed for them. Simply taking pictures of a memorable day out and they were threatened with confiscation of their cameras and being ejected from the ground. Utterly shameful.
Sure, there are some great people at the club who are a pleasure to know and to deal with, but many of those 'on the front line' need to 'up' their inter-personal skills rapidly or they will lose 'customers' faster than a pork butcher at a synagogue.
I shall continue to support the team and the club. I shall continue to commit the usual funds to the Gold Bond and Dale Trust. (Won a tenner recently and bought a new shirt, so the club got that back as well !) I shall probably (but not definitely) attend games on an ad-hoc basis when I feel like it, but unless those 'upstairs' sort out the PR mess, the club will lose it's life-blood.
It's taken me 50-odd years of supporting Dale to get to this stage, but I won't be treated like a cash-cow and then be taken for granted.
It seems that once they've got your money you don't count. All I ask for is some respect and consideration. Sadly, both are seriously lacking. |
Nicely put...
I have to agree with everything you said in that statement...
If it was not for the supporters this club and every club would cease to exist...
Football as always and will always be a closed shop...
I can understand their point if joe bloggs is given a job and then everything is splattered all over the internet..
But we are in the 21st century and its time to move forward and be more open to the supporters..
To me fans forums are a farce its done to appease the fans when the board think its getting a little though...
When you have to forward questions so that they can be vetted is wrong totally wrong... [Post edited 1 Jan 1970 1:00]
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| My all time favourite Dale player Mr Lyndon Symmonds |
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| Liverpool (n/t) on 13:49 - Aug 6 with 1200 views | TalkingSutty |
| Liverpool on 23:46 - Aug 5 by pl56 |
Hang on ... didn't you post earlier that "fans were being treated with contempt by everybody associated with the club" and "I am seriously thinking of packing in" ?
In comparison Wigandale's lack of commitment to the Trust seems somewhat mild .
If you're thinking of packing in your support for the Club (my interpretation of your earlier comment) , then I assume you will also "pack in" any involvement with the Trust ? |
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| Liverpool on 15:27 - Aug 6 with 1122 views | pl56 |
This thread is becoming something of a critical tipping point for the club . By my assessessment of the posters on it , including my 50+ years along with SuddenLad's , there must be some 500 years of support that has already expressed disillusionment with the present situation on a scale from "great to utter" .
No organisation surely can survive such alienation of its traditional customer base over that kind of period of time , particularly where that alienation leads to withdrawal both of business and investment .
Fans of that longevity are critical stakeholders in the future of the club , as well as the younger audience , and when we have lived through such dross in the past , but are currently as dissatisfied as we have ever been , then something is seriously and glaringly wrong . If the club continues to get the basics wrong , particularly re communications and marketing as I've said before ad nauseum , then we'll soon be back to the state we were in during the darkest of days of the past .
All organisations need to have clearly lineated lines of accountability , and there seems noone taking responsibility for key business areas . In any other business the buck should stop with the Chief Executive but its been suggested elsewhere that his responsibilities lie on the football side of things . If that's the case , where does the buck stop for the business side of things ..... who is accountable for this widespread apathy at present ?
Thack's Rabbit has contributed constructively to this thread ; I just hope someone somewhere has had sight of his comments , and has taken due note ! | | | |
| Liverpool on 16:58 - Aug 6 with 1033 views | Reedy |
| Liverpool on 15:27 - Aug 6 by pl56 |
This thread is becoming something of a critical tipping point for the club . By my assessessment of the posters on it , including my 50+ years along with SuddenLad's , there must be some 500 years of support that has already expressed disillusionment with the present situation on a scale from "great to utter" .
No organisation surely can survive such alienation of its traditional customer base over that kind of period of time , particularly where that alienation leads to withdrawal both of business and investment .
Fans of that longevity are critical stakeholders in the future of the club , as well as the younger audience , and when we have lived through such dross in the past , but are currently as dissatisfied as we have ever been , then something is seriously and glaringly wrong . If the club continues to get the basics wrong , particularly re communications and marketing as I've said before ad nauseum , then we'll soon be back to the state we were in during the darkest of days of the past .
All organisations need to have clearly lineated lines of accountability , and there seems noone taking responsibility for key business areas . In any other business the buck should stop with the Chief Executive but its been suggested elsewhere that his responsibilities lie on the football side of things . If that's the case , where does the buck stop for the business side of things ..... who is accountable for this widespread apathy at present ?
Thack's Rabbit has contributed constructively to this thread ; I just hope someone somewhere has had sight of his comments , and has taken due note ! |
I very rarely post on here, but read a lot of threads.
A lot has been made at the lack of communication from the club over a whole variety of subjects, all of which are very important, in there own way. The club is practically in the middle ages when it comes to communication.
What worries me, if I was the boss of any company, and read similar things being said about my staff, I would want to know why they were being said, and why certain staff aren't pulling their weight. They would be out the door with no hesitation. Too many people are in their comfort zone, and have been for too long. It needs (Like JC has done with the squad) to shake up the club behind the scenes, it need's to be done, and soon.
I used to love going to football, and in many ways I still do, but the way the club has treated it's customers recently, is a farce. If I had a choice, I would take my custom elsewhere.
I feel I do my share for the club, but the thanks we all receive is minimal (and that's at a push!)
It's already too late, to implement many changes that should have occurred. The amount of opportunities missed beggars belief, and they will continue to be missed someone goes in there and says some home truths.
I hope people are brave enough on Thursday night to share their (correct) opinions, to see the reaction of the board. If I was Chairman and reading this, I wouldn't be reading riot acts, I would be screaming them, failing that they would be swiftly booted out of the door, to make way for someone with enthusiasm for the job, and more importantly the club. [Post edited 1 Jan 1970 1:00]
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| Liverpool on 17:24 - Aug 6 with 986 views | sandylaner1 |
some fantastic posts in this thread like many have said, but voices must be heard.
I for one, am looking forward to the fans forum on Thursday as its certainly going to be an interesting evening |  | | |
| Liverpool on 17:34 - Aug 6 with 964 views | Thacks_Rabbits |
| Liverpool on 17:24 - Aug 6 by sandylaner1 |
some fantastic posts in this thread like many have said, but voices must be heard.
I for one, am looking forward to the fans forum on Thursday as its certainly going to be an interesting evening |
Although exiled I am tempted to drive over Thursday for the forum.
Is it tickets required up front etc or is it just turn up - If someone can let me know the details that would be good.
Sure its on here somewhere but rather than look about eh :) | |
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| Liverpool on 17:36 - Aug 6 with 961 views | isitme |
Free admission, just turn up on the night. | | | |
| Liverpool on 18:13 - Aug 6 with 902 views | TalkingSutty |
| Liverpool on 23:46 - Aug 5 by pl56 |
Hang on ... didn't you post earlier that "fans were being treated with contempt by everybody associated with the club" and "I am seriously thinking of packing in" ?
In comparison Wigandale's lack of commitment to the Trust seems somewhat mild .
If you're thinking of packing in your support for the Club (my interpretation of your earlier comment) , then I assume you will also "pack in" any involvement with the Trust ? |
I responded to Wigandales post in relation to not joining the trust. The trust and the way the club treats its supporters are two seperate issues. There seems to be some supporters who see the change of mind BY THE CLUB regarding the Bowlee training venue as something the Trust should be castigated for. The decision had nothing to do with the trust and they couldnt forsee the change of mind prior to the fund raising walk taking place.
They seem to have copped some flak for it though and i dont now why ? If i decided to stop supporting the club, it would be because of how i feel i am valued as a supporter and also because of the match day exprience, obviously i would no longer be a trust member ( wouldnt that be obvious?).
The only "involvement" i have with the trust is the fact that i parted with a tenner to join and i try to support any function. I just think it makes sense to try to support the trust as a fan and in no way was i having a go at WD. Just pointing out that the "U-turn" in the training facility was nothing to do with trust (it left them in a embarrassing position) and shouldnt be held against them when it comes to renewing trust membership. Hope my explanation helps !! | | | |
| Liverpool on 20:10 - Aug 6 with 789 views | pl56 |
| Liverpool on 18:13 - Aug 6 by TalkingSutty |
I responded to Wigandales post in relation to not joining the trust. The trust and the way the club treats its supporters are two seperate issues. There seems to be some supporters who see the change of mind BY THE CLUB regarding the Bowlee training venue as something the Trust should be castigated for. The decision had nothing to do with the trust and they couldnt forsee the change of mind prior to the fund raising walk taking place.
They seem to have copped some flak for it though and i dont now why ? If i decided to stop supporting the club, it would be because of how i feel i am valued as a supporter and also because of the match day exprience, obviously i would no longer be a trust member ( wouldnt that be obvious?).
The only "involvement" i have with the trust is the fact that i parted with a tenner to join and i try to support any function. I just think it makes sense to try to support the trust as a fan and in no way was i having a go at WD. Just pointing out that the "U-turn" in the training facility was nothing to do with trust (it left them in a embarrassing position) and shouldnt be held against them when it comes to renewing trust membership. Hope my explanation helps !! |
Apologies - the reference to training facilities in WD's post was oblique to the point of being unrecognisable as such to an outsider like me .
Having reread in that context I now see the arguments more clearly , so the explanation certainly has been helpful . | | | |
| Liverpool on 20:32 - Aug 6 with 750 views | R17ALE |
| Liverpool on 23:44 - Aug 5 by Thacks_Rabbits |
Razz - Your totally correct - Since Les went, and yourself and Richard its gone downhill totally.
I always remember Les telling me that "If you want a proper job - you dont want to be a commercial manager at Rochdale" 20 - years ago that must have been but how bloody true!!!!
In the same way they throw 80k a year at a player to show ambition - why not do the same with the marketing of the club - even if its based on returns!!!!
Hand on heart if they said - here is 40k a year - make us 400k more than we do now - it would not be an issue - The same would apply if they gave you the role and freedom to manage the place properly.
I would offer my services - 17 years expirience in financial services and great knowledge of marketing - you think I will get a message off C.D.???? - And yet I think I can raise the club £360k per year pre tax more, per year.
Bit of a no brainer really!!!!
BTW ty TBBT - I dont do twitter but thats yet another option that the club dont use!!!!!! |
Check your PM TR, top right hand corner of your screen - a red flashing light! | |
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| Liverpool on 20:51 - Aug 6 with 708 views | TalkingSutty |
| Liverpool on 20:10 - Aug 6 by pl56 |
Apologies - the reference to training facilities in WD's post was oblique to the point of being unrecognisable as such to an outsider like me .
Having reread in that context I now see the arguments more clearly , so the explanation certainly has been helpful . |
No probs, its easy for things to get misinterpreted on forums. I think as fans we are all a bit frustrated at the moment but if we didnt care we wouldnt go to the effort of posting our feelings.
Although i feel like jacking my support in i cant, but it doesnt mean i am happy with the way the club promotes itself or the way our few fans are taken for granted. | | | |
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