| Armstrong extended on 13:55 - Jun 14 with 1858 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Armstrong extended on 13:43 - Jun 14 by QPROslo |
Sounds like Sinclair needs a new agent. Have no evidence for this, but I think many find him an exciting player to watch and would guess that if he's expected to play a part of a game he gets a few more people at games and watching from wherever, to the Clubs benefit as well of course. I'll be delighted if he's with us this next season, but hope he signs a new contract. |
On the face of it I get it.
A international player who’s popular with the fans and has just won YPOTY.
But in reality it’s says more to the low quality of Ireland (sorry Bri) and our own youth system, and the popularity will soon diminish the longer the dilly dallying over a contract goes on. |  | |  |
| Armstrong extended on 14:01 - Jun 14 with 1813 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| Armstrong extended on 12:38 - Jun 14 by daveB |
Those are all things that can be worked on and fixed, he's only 20.
Les Ferdinand at the same age was playing at Hayes and lacked a lot of things until he was about 24/25 |
Don't know if there's any evidence to support it but my feeling is that players tend to peak earlier these days - the game is far faster and more physically demanding than it was in the 1990s.
That said, I like Armstrong and think he's being foolish here. Stay with us under a decent manager for a couple of seasons, develop further, score some goals and then get your dream move. He must know how much he is loved by the fans too. [Post edited 14 Jun 14:01]
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| Armstrong extended on 14:13 - Jun 14 with 1750 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Armstrong extended on 13:31 - Jun 14 by TK1 |
Armstrong's a substantially better (if similar) player to Les Ferdinand at 21, far more experienced already, with more than one type of goal in him - as proven last season: compare the goals he got v Leicester, Bournemouth and Millwall. In another 50 games, he'll be putting those together regularly (and perhaps even winning headers). By 24, he'll be an absolute monster. Les didn't become a regular goalscorer until he was 25 in England. Like LF, Armstrong has come to the position later than many of his rivals, but it's all there to grow into. (Ian Wright is another example).
If he escapes serious injury, he'll be playing successfully at a much higher level. It's weird to me that others can't see this in this just turned 21-year-old. Already he changes games and worries defenders at this level. He should sign a two-year extension and kick on.
Having said that, if he doesn't want to stay we have to sell now. I feel the same about the manager too: he belongs at a higher level and will get there too, but if he's ready to go now, so be it. We can't get hung up on staff or players. |
While I agree that many are discounting or underplaying the development potential of Armstrong, I have to disagree with this entirely. I watched Ferdinand in the reserves almost every home game (how I didn't get fired from that job I'll never know!) and his all-round game was miles and miles ahead of where Armstrong's is now. Superb in the air, far superior technique, better movement, a savage shot, a decent dribbler, and capable of tap-ins and poaching as well. It's certainly true that he developed all of those skills massively, but I think that many Rangers fans of today are perhaps guilty of revisionism when they now talk of Ferdinand's limited skillset upon arrival. It was already substantial.
Within a week of him arriving Macca told a few of us that he was the new Cyrille Regis. Even if he was half-ribbing the listening Ferdinand, we knew he was also half-serious. Very soon, we knew that Ferdinand had the potential to be that and more, the worry was whether Rangers would have the patience.
I see very little comparison as of now, but I'm not writing off Armstrong's development potential. I would be absolutely delighted if in the next year he became what the 21-yr old Ferdinand was. |  |
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| Armstrong extended on 14:14 - Jun 14 with 1716 views | stainrods_elbow |
| Armstrong extended on 12:05 - Jun 12 by MedwayR |
Who's going to pay money for him, his stats are awful and despite taking great strides he's still incredibly raw. On a free, someone might give him a 2-3 year contract on the off chance he develops but as things stand he seems more suited to American Football. Next season is a big one for him, he needs to prove himself. |
This with brass knobs on - let's hope that's how he (and his agent) see it! |  |
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| Armstrong extended on 14:17 - Jun 14 with 1676 views | stainrods_elbow |
| Armstrong extended on 16:18 - Jun 12 by BrianWilson |
Think a championship club with a bit of money to throw around or a low level prem club could take a chance on him but he won't get first team opportunities so easy and would be seen as one to develop perhaps over a long contract. [Post edited 12 Jun 16:19]
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A low level Prem club!? What happy drugs are on you on, sir?
Succinctly,, he needs to step up by Xmas, or be shipped out. | |
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| Armstrong extended on 14:22 - Jun 14 with 1660 views | daveB |
| Armstrong extended on 13:13 - Jun 14 by 1JD |
It’s possible, Dave but he’s got to develop significantly. Whilst Ferdinand played in the same position, I think Kakay is a more recent example of how difficult it is to develop the technical side of the game to succeed at championship level, despite playing 100+ games.
Armstrong is weak on all similar technical characteristics- touch, technique, composure, awareness etc- and instead excels at the athletic side of the game - strength, pace, power. Kakay likewise was more of an athlete, stamina, energy, robustness, than footballer, and was unable to raise his game.
Still early days but the jury is out. Contract situation complicating things considerably. |
I should say I don't think he'll be anywhere near as good as Ferdinand was but he does have time to grow and improve. I wouldn't be surprised if he moved on this summer though as I can't see the club wanting to invest the time needed to improve him if he then leaves for nothing next summer |  | | |
| Armstrong extended on 14:51 - Jun 14 with 1556 views | TK1 |
| Armstrong extended on 14:13 - Jun 14 by BrianMcCarthy |
While I agree that many are discounting or underplaying the development potential of Armstrong, I have to disagree with this entirely. I watched Ferdinand in the reserves almost every home game (how I didn't get fired from that job I'll never know!) and his all-round game was miles and miles ahead of where Armstrong's is now. Superb in the air, far superior technique, better movement, a savage shot, a decent dribbler, and capable of tap-ins and poaching as well. It's certainly true that he developed all of those skills massively, but I think that many Rangers fans of today are perhaps guilty of revisionism when they now talk of Ferdinand's limited skillset upon arrival. It was already substantial.
Within a week of him arriving Macca told a few of us that he was the new Cyrille Regis. Even if he was half-ribbing the listening Ferdinand, we knew he was also half-serious. Very soon, we knew that Ferdinand had the potential to be that and more, the worry was whether Rangers would have the patience.
I see very little comparison as of now, but I'm not writing off Armstrong's development potential. I would be absolutely delighted if in the next year he became what the 21-yr old Ferdinand was. |
At 21? He was nowhere near the first team, and I'll take your word on barnstorming the reserves...but it was the reserves. I saw his earliest league games and he was not there, not until 1990 at least. He's said that himself! Armstrong's been playing in an appalling relegation-haunted team in huge pressure games in front of gnarly crowds. It's a different level. You may say we're guilty of revisionism, but I say you're wearing rose-tinted specs Brian. Les had played a grand total of 3 league games by Armstrong's age. Armstrong has played sixty times.
And actually, Sinclair's still 20 for another week.
Les came back from Turkey when he was pushing 23 and looked a different player (but still wasn't even third choice). He wasn't a regular until he was 24 going on 25. It took him time. He did not arrive from Hayes at 20 (Armstrong's age) ready for regular league football for another three/four years. | | | |
| Armstrong extended on 14:52 - Jun 14 with 1555 views | simmo |
| Armstrong extended on 13:00 - Jun 14 by Ned_Kennedys |
I’m well thanks.
Be interested to know who you think are sh1t Championship central defenders as most seem to be able to do the basics of heading, kicking and marking quite well to me. At the moment most of them can cope quite well with Armstrong apart from in a foot race and even then he decides to fall over too often. He needs to work on how he can get the better of average defenders. |
Morgan Fox has about 250 Championship games... There's loads of very basic/poor defenders in this league, most of them have played for us. |  |
| ask Beavis I get nothing Butthead |
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| Armstrong extended on 14:52 - Jun 14 with 1553 views | rbee |
| Armstrong extended on 16:18 - Jun 12 by BrianWilson |
Think a championship club with a bit of money to throw around or a low level prem club could take a chance on him but he won't get first team opportunities so easy and would be seen as one to develop perhaps over a long contract. [Post edited 12 Jun 16:19]
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I hope he won't get many first team opportunities with us unless he improves. More than happy for him to be retained on a similar deal with added appearance and goal bonuses to see if he becomes a much better footballer but if he wants too much money now then move him on and let another club take the risk.
Do we know how much Armstrong really wants it? Any reports of extra training and the like. Sir Les put many extra hours in especially with weights to become the player he was. |  | | |
| Armstrong extended on 14:57 - Jun 14 with 1539 views | Northernr |
| Armstrong extended on 14:52 - Jun 14 by simmo |
Morgan Fox has about 250 Championship games... There's loads of very basic/poor defenders in this league, most of them have played for us. |
Is it time for the Joel Lynch sizzle reel? |  | | |
| Armstrong extended on 15:01 - Jun 14 with 1520 views | rbee |
| Armstrong extended on 14:57 - Jun 14 by Northernr |
Is it time for the Joel Lynch sizzle reel? |
I believe it's the same length as the Richard Ord sizzle reel. | | | |
| Armstrong extended on 15:11 - Jun 14 with 1479 views | Ned_Kennedys |
| Armstrong extended on 14:52 - Jun 14 by simmo |
Morgan Fox has about 250 Championship games... There's loads of very basic/poor defenders in this league, most of them have played for us. |
Yeah Morgan Fox is a functional defender, not great but does the basics hence why he has played so many games at this level. Good squad player. Certainly not sh1t is he?
Poor example. |  | | |
| Armstrong extended on 15:19 - Jun 14 with 1460 views | SpongeParr |
| Armstrong extended on 13:31 - Jun 14 by TK1 |
Armstrong's a substantially better (if similar) player to Les Ferdinand at 21, far more experienced already, with more than one type of goal in him - as proven last season: compare the goals he got v Leicester, Bournemouth and Millwall. In another 50 games, he'll be putting those together regularly (and perhaps even winning headers). By 24, he'll be an absolute monster. Les didn't become a regular goalscorer until he was 25 in England. Like LF, Armstrong has come to the position later than many of his rivals, but it's all there to grow into. (Ian Wright is another example).
If he escapes serious injury, he'll be playing successfully at a much higher level. It's weird to me that others can't see this in this just turned 21-year-old. Already he changes games and worries defenders at this level. He should sign a two-year extension and kick on.
Having said that, if he doesn't want to stay we have to sell now. I feel the same about the manager too: he belongs at a higher level and will get there too, but if he's ready to go now, so be it. We can't get hung up on staff or players. |
Are you his agent? | | | |
| Armstrong extended on 15:32 - Jun 14 with 1435 views | 1JD |
| Armstrong extended on 14:22 - Jun 14 by daveB |
I should say I don't think he'll be anywhere near as good as Ferdinand was but he does have time to grow and improve. I wouldn't be surprised if he moved on this summer though as I can't see the club wanting to invest the time needed to improve him if he then leaves for nothing next summer |
Well, it looks like because he is u24, we will be due a compensation fee next summer as and when he is out of contract.
So, the club could consider this season a “free hit”, and see how he develops through the season.
If he grows and performs considerably, they could then agree to meet his wage demands, since they will have proof of development rather than theory and unknowns right now. | | | |
| Armstrong extended on 15:46 - Jun 14 with 1373 views | kensalriser |
I see him as the latest in a long line of players like Richard Pacquette and Angelo Balanta that many fans are irrationally optimistic about despite a lack of any real supporting evidence. |  |
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| Armstrong extended on 15:53 - Jun 14 with 1324 views | simmo |
250 games for a not great 'functional' player that does the basics - I think that's the point | |
| ask Beavis I get nothing Butthead |
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| Armstrong extended on 16:01 - Jun 14 with 1278 views | daveB |
| Armstrong extended on 15:32 - Jun 14 by 1JD |
Well, it looks like because he is u24, we will be due a compensation fee next summer as and when he is out of contract.
So, the club could consider this season a “free hit”, and see how he develops through the season.
If he grows and performs considerably, they could then agree to meet his wage demands, since they will have proof of development rather than theory and unknowns right now. |
Thats true I forgot about that compensation fee, maybe he will stay | | | |
| Armstrong extended on 16:43 - Jun 14 with 1187 views | LazyFan |
| Armstrong extended on 15:11 - Jun 14 by Ned_Kennedys |
Yeah Morgan Fox is a functional defender, not great but does the basics hence why he has played so many games at this level. Good squad player. Certainly not sh1t is he?
Poor example. |
Morgan Fox is a bit better than functional.
I watched him a little when he came back into the team at LB, and he can actually cross the ball very well, indeed, from the left-back position without beating the defender. Something Paal does not have.
I suspect that he has a very good left foot, and this is known in the industry, hence his recall to the Wales squad when he hadn't played much; those in the know were in the know. Marti obviously saw it in training and brought him in ahead of Larkeche for that reason and, of course, his height.
Morgan is above average in the Champ skills, however, due to his age and lack of pace, he should be a sub and not a starter. Useful backup and we need those as Cook and JCS can get injured. If they go at the same time we can struggle by with Fox and Dunne, with Cannon at RB.
I remember when we had no CD reserves of note and struggled for LB let along backups. QPR have done a decent job in building a cheap squad that has backups now in defence for the long campaign that the Champ is. |  |
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| Armstrong extended on 16:48 - Jun 14 with 1153 views | derbyhoop |
I think Armstrong needs to become a 10-15 goal preseason striker, starting this year. If he can't then he's not going to get a big money move. If he does show the results, we need to get him tied down ASAP. On a long, lucrative contract, with decent release clauses. |  |
| Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one’s lifetime. (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop |
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| Armstrong extended on 17:04 - Jun 14 with 1114 views | Wilkinswatercarrier |
| Armstrong extended on 14:13 - Jun 14 by BrianMcCarthy |
While I agree that many are discounting or underplaying the development potential of Armstrong, I have to disagree with this entirely. I watched Ferdinand in the reserves almost every home game (how I didn't get fired from that job I'll never know!) and his all-round game was miles and miles ahead of where Armstrong's is now. Superb in the air, far superior technique, better movement, a savage shot, a decent dribbler, and capable of tap-ins and poaching as well. It's certainly true that he developed all of those skills massively, but I think that many Rangers fans of today are perhaps guilty of revisionism when they now talk of Ferdinand's limited skillset upon arrival. It was already substantial.
Within a week of him arriving Macca told a few of us that he was the new Cyrille Regis. Even if he was half-ribbing the listening Ferdinand, we knew he was also half-serious. Very soon, we knew that Ferdinand had the potential to be that and more, the worry was whether Rangers would have the patience.
I see very little comparison as of now, but I'm not writing off Armstrong's development potential. I would be absolutely delighted if in the next year he became what the 21-yr old Ferdinand was. |
Totally agree about Ferdinand being a late bloomer. That loan in Beskitas made him, and then got 2 goals against that load down the road on his 23rd birthday. He was clearly a good player when we signed him from Hayes.
However, there is one massive difference. Ferdinand did that in the PL, or Div 1, Armstrong can't get ahead of Dykes or Frey. MC even tried Kelman before Armstrong!!
Hopefully we get another (bloody) striker in and sell Armstrong off quick. He doesn't want to be here, else he would have signed a new deal. Something Ferdinand did several times. | | | |
| Armstrong extended on 17:11 - Jun 14 with 1098 views | WatfordR |
| Armstrong extended on 16:48 - Jun 14 by derbyhoop |
I think Armstrong needs to become a 10-15 goal preseason striker, starting this year. If he can't then he's not going to get a big money move. If he does show the results, we need to get him tied down ASAP. On a long, lucrative contract, with decent release clauses. |
If he scores 10-15 goals in pre season, I think we'll all start getting excited  |  | | |
| Armstrong extended on 21:21 - Jun 14 with 862 views | derbyhoop |
| Armstrong extended on 17:11 - Jun 14 by WatfordR |
If he scores 10-15 goals in pre season, I think we'll all start getting excited |
Bloody spell checker.
Should have been per season.  | |
| Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one’s lifetime. (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop |
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| Armstrong extended on 22:41 - Jun 14 with 743 views | wombat |
| Armstrong extended on 14:57 - Jun 14 by Northernr |
Is it time for the Joel Lynch sizzle reel? |
Is that’s the annual Dubai Xmas holiday reel ? |  |
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| Armstrong extended on 22:42 - Jun 14 with 739 views | Hoopsie |
| Armstrong extended on 21:21 - Jun 14 by derbyhoop |
Bloody spell checker.
Should have been per season. |
The official site has no interview quotes from Armstrong about his contract extension, only the usual Nourry speak.
Pretty unusual as for the others there is a short quote of telling us how over the moon they were
Is this a breakdown in negotiation for a longer deal? He is not as happy?
One of a few things
- longer contract not attractive to the player, wants more (£)?
- he didn’t sign what’s on offer, so club triggered the one year option so they won’t lose him on a free
- does that mean the club values him but he (or agent) has a inflated valuation of his current worth? |  |
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| Armstrong extended on 22:54 - Jun 14 with 712 views | QPR_Jim |
| Armstrong extended on 22:42 - Jun 14 by Hoopsie |
The official site has no interview quotes from Armstrong about his contract extension, only the usual Nourry speak.
Pretty unusual as for the others there is a short quote of telling us how over the moon they were
Is this a breakdown in negotiation for a longer deal? He is not as happy?
One of a few things
- longer contract not attractive to the player, wants more (£)?
- he didn’t sign what’s on offer, so club triggered the one year option so they won’t lose him on a free
- does that mean the club values him but he (or agent) has a inflated valuation of his current worth? |
Is it possible we've triggered it as a stop gap, I assume negotiations with Armstrong were dragging on and he was reaching the end of his contract, so we've triggered the extension to stop him running out of contract while we're negotiating.
It's possible that we're still negotiating a longer term deal and they may not be that far apart but we've needed to extend just to buy us some time to get it completed. Would explain the lack of fanfare if we're hoping for a bigger announcement in a few months. Well, that's what I'm hoping anyway. |  | | |
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